Hornworms or silkworms?

[Jon114]

Which is better and why?

Would like to get silkworms, but I'm a bit put off by their unhardy nature. Mulberryfarms is out of live silkies, too. I'm not sure how hard hatching eggs would be.

Hornworms grow faster, and appear easier to breed as long as you have tomatoe plants. They're hardier, too?

Help me decide!

 

[Kaianuanu]

silkies are a lot more nutritious, hornworms are not the best for a staple.

 

[pigglett79]

Silks are easier to breed and also much more nutritious.

 

[nick barta]

Horns are 9% protein, 3% fat.
Silks are 63.8% protein, 11% fat.

So, silks are more protein % by far than a horn worm, or a cricket at 21.30%.

With all these %, remember a larger prey item @ a lower % of protein will take several of the smaller prey items to get the same amount of protein in your animal. One large horn worm @ 9% protein would take a lot of silks to hit the same amount of protein into your cham. % mean nothing if it isn't inside the cham...

Since Hornworms are mostly water, they are great for hydration, and unlike super worms(17.90% fat) or or wax worms(22.20% fat) you don't add much fat to the diet. "Water Insurance" when you not sure your cham is drinking.

Silks are the best protein feeder, are very soft so larger silks can be fed to smaller chams, and we can grow them to a fairly large size. The silk worm is, in my opinion, the "best" choice for protein. Second is Dubias at 35.6% protein.

Crickets have only 21.3% protein, so it will take a LOT of crickets to equal a large silk worm in protein. The obvious advantages to crickets from OUR standpoint is low cost, availability, and the best movement to attract the cham to feed, other than my personal moving quickly favorite, the Blue Bottle fly.

 

[pigglett79]

I agree, I do love hornworms for the hydration. If there is ever an issue with hydration or you need to rehab a cham that is dehydrated you could use horns for sure. Silks are just in my opinion an easier feeder to breed and more nutritious in general.

I am using horns right now for an adopted 4 yr old bearded dragon who refuses to eat any sort of fruit or veggie.

 

[Jon114]

Where's a good place to get silkworms from? I'm thinking about getting eggs from mulberryfarms but I'm not too sure if I want to risk hatching eggs. What about coastalsilkworms?

Also, is there a need for a lid when my room's RH is already high? (70%)

 

[nick barta]

Either Coastal or Mulberry can supply eggs or silk worms. Coastal tends to have larger sizes available.

If you are getting eggs, ask if they just came in, or if you should wait until the next inbound shipment.

 

[carol5208]

Horns are 9% protein, 3% fat.
Silks are 63.8% protein, 11% fat.

So, silks are more protein % by far than a horn worm, or a cricket at 21.30%.

With all these %, remember a larger prey item @ a lower % of protein will take several of the smaller prey items to get the same amount of protein in your animal. One large horn worm @ 9% protein would take a lot of silks to hit the same amount of protein into your cham. % mean nothing if it isn't inside the cham...

Since Hornworms are mostly water, they are great for hydration, and unlike super worms(17.90% fat) or or wax worms(22.20% fat) you don't add much fat to the diet. "Water Insurance" when you not sure your cham is drinking.

Silks are the best protein feeder, are very soft so larger silks can be fed to smaller chams, and we can grow them to a fairly large size. The silk worm is, in my opinion, the "best" choice for protein. Second is Dubias at 35.6% protein.

Crickets have only 21.3% protein, so it will take a LOT of crickets to equal a large silk worm in protein. The obvious advantages to crickets from OUR standpoint is low cost, availability, and the best movement to attract the cham to feed, other than my personal moving quickly favorite, the Blue Bottle fly.

I have never seen the silk nutritional value with a fat % higher than 6%. I am not sure if that is accurate or maybe everyone else is wrong!

 

[sandrachameleon]

Which is better and why?

Would like to get silkworms, but I'm a bit put off by their unhardy nature. Mulberryfarms is out of live silkies, too. I'm not sure how hard hatching eggs would be.

Hornworms grow faster, and appear easier to breed as long as you have tomatoe plants. They're hardier, too?

Help me decide!

I'd go with silkworms. They are NOT unhardy. Quite easy, not nearly as sensitive as some people make them out to be. You can gutload them on a variety of foods, they don't get too huge too fast, and I've they naturally contain a substance that promotes calcium absorption. I found silkworms easy to breed and raise from eggs. No lid required- they don't travel so long as food comes to them on a regular basis.

 

[Jon114]

I'd go with silkworms. They are NOT unhardy. Quite easy, not nearly as sensitive as some people make them out to be. You can gutload them on a variety of foods, they don't get too huge too fast, and I've they naturally contain a substance that promotes calcium absorption. I found silkworms easy to breed and raise from eggs. No lid required- they don't travel so long as food comes to them on a regular basis.

Thanks, I do feel a bit better about them now. I ordered 200 eggs and a pound of dry silkie chow.

Using a heatpad, a small container, and a thermostat I've managed to make a makeshift incubator with the temps sticking at 79-83 degrees. I suppose this will suffice for hatching the eggs and raising small silkies?

There's a bunch of great guides out there, but as you're pretty much the nutrition and food guru here on these forums, how do you keep and raise your silkworms?

 

[Psychobunny]

Already said it all, but horns are great if your cham is not drinking, needs water, and like to eat them.
I have never really tried to raise them, but I had a bunch turn into cocoons and hatch into moths.
They made a nasty mess! like, projectile vomit, exorcist style, all over the walls of their plastic box!!
They died shortly after spraying the place with worm puke.

Never tried that again!!

 

[Jon114]

Already said it all, but horns are great if your cham is not drinking, needs water, and like to eat them.
I have never really tried to raise them, but I had a bunch turn into cocoons and hatch into moths.
They made a nasty mess! like, projectile vomit, exorcist style, all over the walls of their plastic box!!
They died shortly after spraying the place with worm puke.

Never tried that again!!

Gross. There's two thinks in this world that disgust me, and that's parasites, and insect fluids...blech!

 

[sandrachameleon]

Thanks, I do feel a bit better about them now. I ordered 200 eggs and a pound of dry silkie chow.

Using a heatpad, a small container, and a thermostat I've managed to make a makeshift incubator with the temps sticking at 79-83 degrees. I suppose this will suffice for hatching the eggs and raising small silkies?

There's a bunch of great guides out there, but as you're pretty much the nutrition and food guru here on these forums, how do you keep and raise your silkworms?

I raised them without a heat pad, just kept them in plastic deli-type containers in the chameleon room (which is warm, but not hot).

what I've done and good info from others here:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/what-do-you-keep-your-silkworms-26605/#post241334
https://www.chameleonforums.com/silkworms-101-a-7906/
http://www.chameleonnews.com/05FebCaruthers.html
http://www.wormspit.com/bombyxsilkworms.htm