Starting out, any help/opinions appretiated!

Hi all, just found this forum after looking for a good place to gather some information about chameleons, it looks full of info!

Anyway I am planning on getting a panther chameleon soon. I already own a bearded dragon and have done for around 2 years and I am looking to get something more challenging! But I have a few questions.

From what I've gathered so far, panthers are somewhere in the middle in terms of difficulty out of the chameleons and are also one of the friendliest chams you can get, am I right in believing this?

I also wandered what sort of a set up I am looking to provide for a baby panther, as a place I am intending to get one from has young chams and I have been advised to keep the viv quite simple at the start, as to not cause complications.

What sort of lighting would you say is best in your opinions, I mean heat and light, is there a combo that works best for chameleons. I was going to get a small tube 5.0 UV bulb and a red/nocturnal heat bulb (around 60 watts) is this the sort of thing you would recommend?

I have also been told that all mesh vivs are better suiting to keeping chameleons in America and that as I live in the UK a mesh lid/ half mesh viv would be better as it is colder in the UK.

Last question for now, the cham I intend to get is going to come with a small exo terra viv as a starter for the first few months as the cham is a few months old. In terms of sizes it looks like the right size viv but I was curious as to what sizes you all put your young'uns in.

Any help is greatly appreciated, as I do not want to jump in the deep end with this one and what to be prepared for everything.

MattiBee said:

Hi all, just found this forum after looking for a good place to gather some information about chameleons, it looks full of info!Thanks! This is a great forum.

Anyway I am planning on getting a panther chameleon soon. I already own a bearded dragon and have done for around 2 years and I am looking to get something more challenging! But I have a few questions.

From what I've gathered so far, panthers are somewhere in the middle in terms of difficulty out of the chameleons and are also one of the friendliest chams you can get, am I right in believing this? Yes, most chameleons are a middle of the road pet as far a difficulty. Panthers are nicer than veileds, but still grumpy.

I also wandered what sort of a set up I am looking to provide for a baby panther, as a place I am intending to get one from has young chams and I have been advised to keep the viv quite simple at the start, as to not cause complications.How old is the chameleon that you are getting? I would advise you not to get anything younger than 3 months. You are going to pay a large amount of money for a panther, and you dont want it to die because of poor husbandry.

What sort of lighting would you say is best in your opinions, I mean heat and light, is there a combo that works best for chameleons. I was going to get a small tube 5.0 UV bulb and a red/nocturnal heat bulb (around 60 watts) is this the sort of thing you would recommend?One reptisun 5.0 and one house bulb is all that is needed. You wont need a night light unles temperatures drop into the 50's

I have also been told that all mesh vivs are better suiting to keeping chameleons in America and that as I live in the UK a mesh lid/ half mesh viv would be better as it is colder in the UK.Chameleons live in trees and need a lot of air flow. If you plan on blocking a side on the cage make it the side that is up against the wall.

Last question for now, the cham I intend to get is going to come with a small exo terra viv as a starter for the first few months as the cham is a few months old. In terms of sizes it looks like the right size viv but I was curious as to what sizes you all put your young'uns in.

Any help is greatly appreciated, as I do not want to jump in the deep end with this one and what to be prepared for everything.

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Read my caresheet:
Veiled and Panther Care sheet

HOUSING- Adult- With Veiled and Panther chameleons their seems to be a standard of 24(w) x24(d) x48(h). One chameleon per cage! These numbers can be tweaked slightly, such as width and depth. A chameleon cage can never be too high. I would try not to make your cage any less than 18x18, and this is if you don’t have any room. The cage should always be made up of screen. At least four sides (top, left, right, back and front) the top must always be screen because your light will be coming in from there. As far as the other four sides any choice off three is sufficient. I have found the best screen material to use is aluminum. It doesn’t rust or melt. It is also easier to see through and UV light enters the cage easier.
Juvenile- An average size juvenile cage is around an 18x18x36. This size cage is good until about the age of one year. If it is a large male you can upgrade sooner.
BABIES- newly born chameleons can be kept in a glass cage together for 7-8 weeks tops. After the age of two months they should be placed in a fully screened cage, and they can still be kept together. Once they are separated around the age of 2.5-3 months and sold they should be kept in a screen enclosure measuring 12x12x24-30. This should be suffice until the age of 6 months. Now it’s time to upgrade to a juvenile cage.
Safe Plants- Hibiscus-my favorite choice, Jasmine, Ficus Benjamina, Croton, Scheffelera Arobricola (Umbrella Plant), Photos, and Airplants. I have used all of these personally and I have found them easy to find and care for.
WATERING- most chameleons will not drink from standing water. There are rare cases that this occurs, but is not a substitute for proper watering. Proper watering should be done through a dripper all day and misting. I have found that the “Big Dripper” will go all day long if you have it dripping at one drop per second. Hand or automated misting should be done 2-3 times daily. You can use a spray bottle or buy a Pro Mist set-up for about 200$ and it does it by itself. Chameleons drink by shooting his/her tongue out at water droplets on leaves. Live plants are far superior to fake plants. They hold water droplets at the end of each leaf. Silk plants usually have the water drip off as soon as it makes contact. I have found that fake moss is a great way to supply water. If it is placed right under your dripper the water will run down to the tips of each piece. This is between 30-70 ends. Waterfalls and bowls help to harbor the growth of bacteria some of these bacteria can cause an Upper Respiratory Infection (URI), so they should be avoided at all cost.
HUMIDITY- The ambient humidity in the cage should be in the 40-50% range. With a spike of 70-80% during and after misting. This isn’t as true for Veiled Chameleons; they can be kept at a lower humidity. If you aren’t lucky enough to live in Florida a cheap humidifier from Walgreens will be fine. Try to stay away from foggers, as these can be frightening to your chameleon. Not to mention more expensive than a humidifier. Higher humidity also helps aid in the shedding process for your chameleon. Generally you will see an “explosive” shed when humidity is high. Meaning all the skin will come off at once. In lower humidity it may take days for it to come off.
LIGHTING- This is a huge area of concern to a chameleon’s health. UVB light helps with absorption of calcium to create strong bones. UVB also aids in the absorption and production of D3. Without proper UVB light a chameleon can develop MBD (Metabolic Bone Disease). The most fool proof light on the market is the Reptisun 5.0. studies have found it superior to the Reptiglo 5.0 for chameleons. Do not purchase the compact bulb. These have been known to cause eye problems, such as photo-kerato-conjunctivitis. Lights should be kept on for 10-12 hours a day. Chameleons can only absorb the UV from these lights close up. The maximum effective range is about ten inches. I have personally used the latest lighting on the market with great success, the Mercury Vapor Bulbs. They are an all in one, both heat and UVB output. The maximum effective range of these bulbs is over 12 inches. As far as temperature goes, Veiled’s are a little warmer about 95 basking temperature or what I call the “hot spot”. The “hot spot” temperature can be acquired using standard house light bulbs ranging from 45-75 watts. A household bulb admits UVA light that stimulates appetite. This should be the temperature in one area on the top of the cage and the rest should be in the 80’s. The rest of the cage should vary, and into the mid 70’s at the bottom. Panther’s should have a basking temperature around 90 degrees. Same goes for the cage having varying temperatures. Babies should always be cooler around 85 degrees max basking for both species. Remember nothing can compare to natural sunlight. The best time to put your chameleon outside is between 10 and 2 o’clock.
SUPPLEMENTING- This is a key factor in the survival of your chameleon. In captivity we do not supply the chameleon with enough feeders to meet the vitamin/mineral demands of a chameleon. So this is taken care of through dusting and gutloading. Most of the feeders we buy today are high and Phosphorous and low in calcium. There is only one way to take care of this problem. I like to use Herpcares cricket duster because it saves supplement and you don’t need to touch the feeder. Not every cricket needs to be dusted either, nor do they need to look like ghost from being covered in so much calcium. Gutloading is a term used when feeder insects are given food to eat that is rich in nutrients. There are several cricket foods on the market today that can be used. Try to stay away from potatoes because they are very high in phosphorous. There are 3 main supplements used today. My schedule looks like: Mondays and Thursdays- Calcium, Tuesdays and Fridays-Rep Cal Herptivite, Wednesdays and Saturdays- T-Rex Chameleon Formula or Mineral-All(indoor). A lot of people have their own schedule and tricks. I also rotate every week between Calcium with D3 and without D3. A chameleon can overdose and die from too much D3.
FEEDERS- Chameleons need a wide range of feeders to stay healthy. We as owners will never be able to supply them with what they would get in the wild. That is why having several staple feeders with proper supplements and gutloading is critical to the survival of captive chameleons. Some of my favorite feeders are; Crickets, roaches, super worms, Silkworms, hornworms, phoenix worms, butter worms, wax worms, and mealworms. Crickets will most likely be you main feeder, that being said they are very poor in nutritional value. They need to be gut loaded with a good cricket food and 2/3 of them should be dusted per feeding. Silkworms and hornworms are fantastic feeders; these can be placed in the cage and don’t need dusting. They are also ferocious eaters, so keep plenty of food available. Phoenix worms are great for juvenile and baby chameleons; they are high in calcium and do not need to be supplemented. They only grow to about ¾” so aren’t much good for adults.

thanks for all that information, you have a great caresheet there and that has answered many of my queries! If i think of any more would you mind if i sent you a pm? as it seems you have a good understanding of chams! i intend on putting a deposit down for a panther (will find out how old they are before though) and will be getting it as soon as i have everything i need. thanks again!

also, i have noticed in your caresheet you don't mention locusts, is this because they are not meant to be given to chams or is it that they are harder to get in america? I live in the UK and they are widely available and advised as a better alternative to crickets. One drawback though is that we can't get phoenix worms here easily...

Yea, I have spent sometime on my caresheet.lol
I didnt think about putting locust in my caresheet.
Thanks I will do that right away.
I dont think anyone sells them in the US because it is illegal.
When I have the time during the summer I catch a few, but it is a pain.

ohhhh so thats why i dont hear of many people talking about them! I have wondered. I can't wait to get my first chameleon now!

Well, I wish you the best of luck.
Just keep reading and asking question.
Try and get your cage ready a week before your chameleon gets there.
This way it is up and running and you can change and adjust things.
Your dripping water is usually the most major concern.

thanks, yeah thats what i intend to do, so i can monitor the humidity and things before hand. One thing that has just come to mind is what are your views on the exo terra water fall? or similar device (ive seen a couple of different water falls) Ive been told that they are a safe way of adding to the humidity and is possible that your cham will drink from them, but not an alternative to spraying etc.

NO NO NO! lol
waterfalls are a big negative.
They are a pool of bacteria.
The best thing you can do for humidity is buy a humidifier for 25$ at Walgreens.
They are good for you and your chameleon.

MattiBee said:

thanks, yeah thats what i intend to do, so i can monitor the humidity and things before hand. One thing that has just come to mind is what are your views on the exo terra water fall? or similar device (ive seen a couple of different water falls) Ive been told that they are a safe way of adding to the humidity and is possible that your cham will drink from them, but not an alternative to spraying etc.

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no waterfall, mattiBee.
they are ground for bacterias to grow.

lol its amazing how many different things you will hear, thats why i thought i would ask! Ive been told panthers are more friendly that vieled chams but one thing is putting me off is the price tag (plus the fact i love the veiled cham green colouring!) and i was wondering if they really are unfriendly or does it just take a bit more time for them to become tame. I know your not ment to stroke chams but i want to be able to let it walk around on me occasionally. Im sure i said 'last question' about 10 questions ago LOL!

thanks for this.

MattiBee said:

lol its amazing how many different things you will hear, thats why i thought i would ask! Ive been told panthers are more friendly that vieled chams but one thing is putting me off is the price tag (plus the fact i love the veiled cham green colouring!) and i was wondering if they really are unfriendly or does it just take a bit more time for them to become tame. I know your not ment to stroke chams but i want to be able to let it walk around on me occasionally. Im sure i said 'last question' about 10 questions ago LOL!

thanks for this.

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If you like veiled better, i think you should go with veiled.
Both species are very good for beginners.
But, i always felt that veiled is a little bit tougher than panther. and the crest on their head is cool!
Perhaps that's why they are generally more pissy than panthers. But, a pissy chameleon is a good indication of a healthy one.

Yeah i think i will go with a veiled. So if it was slightly moody it wouldn't be an indication that its stressed? Just that its being its normal moody self? lol Im totally fascinated by chams and best part of the time i will just want to observe, but i do want one that i can get used to human contact, if only a little.

If you want a beatiful veiled for half the price buy from the kammers.
chameleonsonly.com they are 150.00 shipped usually.
Every veiled I have seen from them is beautiful!

Yeah i would but unfortunately i live in England so i wouldnt be able to. I'm going to have a look around for chameleon breeders in the UK though.

OH YEA! haha
sorry! lol

lol no worries! there are some lovely little veiled's and a few panthers in the shop near where i live. He keeps them quite well too from what ive seen.

after going in to the shop to take a look at the chameleons i was amazed at how friendly the panther chameleons are! there was a few adult panthers and veileds and then a few babies of each and ive decided to go for a young male panther chameleon! Expected to be pretty bright colours! thanks for all your help

Any time! Here to help... My work here is done...