Transbald Calyptratus (Veiled chameleon)

Hi,

i wanted to show you some of my quite uncommon chameleons.
Here is a morph of the Veiled chameleon (Chamaeleo Calyptratus): Transbald








Some of this babies (for sale!):

Sweet!
You breeder and babies look really nice.
I'm breeding the translucent/transbald veiled morphs, too.
I have about 100 eggs in the incubator.
I'm hoping my first clutch will hatch by the end of this year or early next.
Were you breeders both high ends?
What was the outcome of the babies?

The babies are not my own babies.

I am a breeder of Furcifer Pardalis but i was searching Transbald since years!
A friend of mine is the breeder, his adults are high end, athey show white/pink/black as my own female.

Around 75% of the babies looks high end too but a part of them have only the toes and the tail pink/white

Thanks,

That is great information.
I actually have two low ends, so I'm trying to figure out the genetics.
I try and ask everyone I can that is breeding them.
I try and record all the information I can, that way I can try and make sense of how the gene is passed on.
I keep hearing that it's co-dominant, but it doesn't always work that way.

By the way about génétic, i find the name "Tanslucent-Piedbald" or "Tranbald" totaly wrong.
This names does not take the black coloration in considération.

What's your opinion about the 3 colors: pink, white, black?
3 morphs at the same time? Translucent, albinos, hypermelanistic?
A new but single morph that make 3 weird colors at the sama time?

i am very interested where this thread is going I love veileds and the first time I saw a translucent i was hooked.

I really want a female translucent(non-translucent) to befriend my male because I want to get into these genetics.

Does your friend who breeds these have any more info on these genes? You should direct him here because I would really like to know more about these 3 different colorations

This friend is not really involved or interested on genetics.

He just bought a pair of Veiled Transbald from 2 different breeders and he makes babies

The white and pink are considered the same here in the United States.
We do have some that have white, pink, and black.
On the other hand, we don't have the all black ones.
How much do they sell for over there?

I'm selling some babies, right now, 195 to 250 euros.

You can find them around 300- 400 euros in reptile shops but they only very few shops that propose them for sale.

very nice animals you have there. i was thinking about getting into them but i saw adults for sale at a wholesaler today and that discouraged me. it makes me think the breeder couldnt sell them to the public cause of their high price and low demand so he had no choice but to sell them to a wholesaler. i dont want to invest good money and time into something that isnt going to be woth it at the end.
i do like them alot tho!
good luck!

I think buying an high priced animal in a shop is not a reflex of a responsible breeder.

The experimented and "rich" breeder that wants to buy an high priced animal will always search to find the breeder

i totally agree with you there. good quality animals usually come from smaller private breeders. they put more time and effort into their animals making the quality of their stock way more superior to those of a pet store who just have a couple young teenagers working for minimum wage and know little to nothing about proper reptile husbandry.

I'm sure on this forum there is a lot of breeder.
I'm sure they all do the same: they sell the lower quality animals to shops because this is anonymous (the buyer don't know the breeder's name) and keep the better quality animals to sell by themself to they customers.

Conclusion: if i am right, there is realy more low quality animals in shops than in breeder's "home shops" (no specialy poor quality, i'm not telling it)

Very cool looking chameleons

A quick general question about these guys. I think I probably already know the answer but just in case. Do the spots of white and such ever change position or color when fired up or anything? or are those spots the same all the time? or does it depend on the animal?

My females stay the same in stress and cool (i mean the Transbald colors)

But i think when they are gravid (a lot of black) they can show wome suprisng chages!

I have to wait a bit of months to verify it

Everyone is saying that the piebalds and translucents are so beautifull but did someone ever thought about the consequences of the loss of pigment? I'm don't want to discuss if the animals are nice or not because that's a personal thing. (personally I don't like them)

As you all know the coloration of the skin is used for several purposes like communication, to express emotions and for heating. Chameleons colour dark to absorb heat and they colour light when the have enough. What do you think what happens to the white or black parts? The chameleon cannot control the pigment in these spots so these spots are overheated or undercooled so they are having a hard time controlling their temperature.

I'm wondering how you all think about these things and are there piebalds in the wild?

Miwill said:

I'm wondering how you all think about these things and are there piebalds in the wild?

Click to expand...

Where do you think they got them in the first place!

Miwill said:

I'm sure on this forum there is a lot of breeder.
I'm sure they all do the same: they sell the lower quality animals to shops because this is anonymous (the buyer don't know the breeder's name) and keep the better quality animals to sell by themself to they customers.

Conclusion: if i am right, there is realy more low quality animals in shops than in breeder's "home shops" (no specialy poor quality, i'm not telling it)

Click to expand...

i know alot of us on the forums here refuse to sell our animals to pets shops. There are some larger scale breeders that will wholesale them off, but for most of us smaller operations, we pour to much time and emotion into these beautiful little creatures, that i know when i send them off to new homes, i want to know they are receiving the care they deserve. Not sure if European pets shops are any better but most stores here in the U.S. carry chameleons without the proper knowledge and when that happens, i end up seeing another "I want to rescue the chameleon in the pet shop" thread. The shops around me charge way to much for their chameleons and one in particular, has a really nice nosy be but he is insanely overpriced and has been in the store for over a year and a half.

Arjan said:

Everyone is saying that the piebalds and translucents are so beautifull but did someone ever thought about the consequences of the loss of pigment? I'm don't want to discuss if the animals are nice or not because that's a personal thing. (personally I don't like them)

As you all know the coloration of the skin is used for several purposes like communication, to express emotions and for heating. Chameleons colour dark to absorb heat and they colour light when the have enough. What do you think what happens to the white or black parts? The chameleon cannot control the pigment in these spots so these spots are overheated or undercooled so they are having a hard time controlling their temperature.

I'm wondering how you all think about these things and are there piebalds in the wild?

Click to expand...

I share some of your concerns and opinions. The original mutation may have come from a wc specimen, but I don't know of any piebald populations in the wild.

The origins of Transbald are discussed: wild caugh or inbreeds that finaly create the mutation.

Nicodemayo said:

Where do you think they got them in the first place!

Click to expand...

Actually I think it happens because of inbreed and selective breeding. I think the piebald and translucent spots are genetic errors because the skins looses the ability to do some basic functions. If you have a piebald chameleon and a normal chameleon then the chance that you have piebald juveniles are very small but when you take two piebald adults than the chance of having piebald juveniles are bigger.

Because I think it's a genetic error you won't see piebalds a lot in the wild and because in the wild it doesn't' matter how there partner look like the chance of having piebald juveniles is verry small.

I know that in Europe there is a lot of inbreed especially with Calyptratus because of the import/export restrictions and they are the most popular chameleon among beginners because of it's price. I think that genetic error occur when you breed without any new blood (bloodlines). The same happens with humans. So if you want to have piebald juveniles you have to take two piebald adults to enlarge the amount of piebald juveniles.

So is it healthy to use two adult piebald chameleons for breeding which I think it is a combination of inbreed and genetic errors?

I hope to start a good discussing about this subject (maybe the wrong topic for that, sorry) and I don't want to insult anyone. If I'm totally wrong please tell me with some arguments