Baby veiled sleeping all day?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. - Veiled, male, 1 month?
How long has it been in your care? 2 days
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon? My girlfriend held him for about 45 minutes the first day I had him while I set up the cage. I also took him out for 5 minutes to show some of my friends.
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders? I feed him the smallest crickets possible, I've put about 10-15 in his cage so far and I've seen him eat about 5-6 in two days, they're fed with potatoes and apples.
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule? Reptical calcium powder everyday.
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking? I mist his leaves with a spray bottle for about 30 seconds at a time every couple hours, I've seen him take a couple licks off the branches but not very much it seems.
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. I haven't seen any yet since he's so little.
Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites? No
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you. I just got him recently, so he's super tiny

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions? It's a all screen 18x18x36 I think.
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule? I'm not sure what brand because I'm out of town right now, but the guy at reptile rapture gave me the 2 light setup that he uses for all his chams.
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps? I have the two lights centered above his cage with two different levels of leaves/branches that he can lay on. Not sure what the lamp temperature is, but I have a space heater that I keep around 74 degrees at night.
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind? I just have some fake plants for now.
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor? His cage sits on my nightstand.
Location - Where are you geographically located? I live in Wisconsin.

Current Problem - I've noticed that all my little cham does is sleep. I've seen him eat 5 or so crickets but even then I had to wake him up when they were right in front of him. He's probably just tired from all the travelling and his new environment, but I just want to make sure that if I am doing something wrong I can correct it right away. I've held him a couple of times but he falls asleep on my finger within 30 seconds most of the time. I tried to hold him again today but he tried to run away so I just left him. I'm out of town for the weekend and my mom is taking care of him. So yeah I'm just wondering if it's normal for a little baby to sleep so much. He's only a couple inches long, not including his tail. Please let me know if I'm doing anything wrong! I want my baby Roger to be as healthy as can be. Thanks!

Welcome.

I think we need information you can only give from home. I'm particularly interested in the cage temperatures and the lighting. Maybe you can acquire a thermometer that will let you get a few readings. The temperature at the basking spot and the temperature at the bottom of the cage are the most important.

That is a very young chameleon so it's possible that the problem is not related to care at all. It's also quite true that after only 2 days, he's probably still adjusting to things.

Can you get fruit flies? He's so young he might do better with something really small to eat.

Alright, I'll update this on Sunday night when I'm able to take temperatures and check the exact type of lights I have for him.

He usually prefers to stay about 2/3s the way up the cage in partial shade and sleep.

He also might be older than a month, I'm not really sure and the guy at the store never told me. I've never seen one in a store that's smaller than the one I got. He's about 2 inches long from his nose to the end of his body and he's super skinny. He's super tiny, if you follow this link you can see pictures of him http://www.aandersonphoto.com/Other/Roger

I think he might be okay with the crickets but I'll try the fruit flies too. They fit in his mouth for the most part but he does have to munch on them for a bit.

I'll just try not to handle him and let him get used to his new home.

Thanks a lot!

Thank you for the pictures! He's definitely a baby and very handsome.

My guess is your temps at the top of the cage are too high. If the room is 74 degrees and you have hot lights, it could be more than he needs. A baby like that probably shouldn't have a basking temp over 81 or 82 degrees. When he's an adult, he'll want a basking temp in the mid to high 80s.

Also, they do like a cool down at night. You might want to reset that room heater to 65 degrees. It will save you money and make your chameleon healthier.

Haha I know! He has some really great spots already and he's still just a youngster.

Alright, I'll try that. That makes sense because the lights I got are big enough for him to grow into so a combination of that and the space heater is probably just too much. I just wanted to keep the room warm enough so he wouldn't freeze cause it does get pretty cold around here.

Thanks so much for the help, I just want him to be happy with his new home.

You're welcome.

You can raise the lights up, or use a lower wattage bulb (or both) to keep a lit basking spot but cool it down some.

Unless it gets under 60 for more than a few hours every night, he's going to be fine. I've seen people say they let their adult veileds get down to 50 degrees at night...I'm not suggesting that for your baby, I'm just using that to illustrate: you don't need to keep it warm at night.

Alright thanks I'll try that. I have the two lights centered on the top of his cage, would it also help to move them more to one side or into the corner?

Haha okay, I just wasn't sure how sensitive they are to the cold. I turned the heater down to 60-65 at night and now he's been more active today so the overall temp in his cage must have just been too warm for him.

Thanks for helpin out, I appreciate it.

one side gives more of a chance to get out the heat. what i did was center my uvb and put my basking on the side my water system on the other side. make sure u never spray the bulbs or let them get wet ive read so many times about shattering when misting.

Alright, I'll move it to one side then. I have a dual light thing so the two lights are connected in the same metal housing so I cant really have them spread out but I'll try putting them to one side.

He was probably super tired from his travels, I still didn't think it was normal for him to have his eyes shut all the time, but just by turning the heat down he's become more active.

Thank you!

Aussie said:

Alright, I'll move it to one side then. I have a dual light thing so the two lights are connected in the same metal housing so I cant really have them spread out but I'll try putting them to one side.

He was probably super tired from his travels, I still didn't think it was normal for him to have his eyes shut all the time, but just by turning the heat down he's become more active.

Thank you!

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did he stop closing his eyes? They do not sleep during the day. Even if they are tired, they don't close their eyes. They may rest in the same spot if they are tired but they are not like other animals that sleep during the course of the day. also gutload your crickets better with more variety of fresh fruits and veggies. Also you need calcium with d3 and a multivitamin and use each one bi weekly. would also like to know what brand of lighting you were sold. Just because the pet store recomended it does not mean it is right!

I'm not sure because I'm out of town for the weekend, but I asked my mom to check on him and I'll let you know when she replies. Yeah I thought it was weird that he was keeping his eyes shut all the time, would it have been because his UVB light is too bright for him? The crickets had some potato when I got them and I gave them some apple slices too. I have calcium powder that I've been putting on the crickets, I think the brand is something like ReptiCal or RepCal? And I have the other thing to put on the crickets once a week, but I've only had him for a few days so I haven't given him that yet. I'm not sure about the lighting, but the place I got him from is a small shop that specializes in only reptiles. The guy who owns it is super helpful too and he seems like he knows what he's talking about. The packaging for the lights had chameleons on it too, so it's definitely for them at least. I'll update this tomorrow night with the exact type of lighting. I talked to my mom and she said that he's been climbing around more and has been sitting under his lights for a while. She also said that he's had his eyes open and that he's been hanging upside down from the top of the cage all afternoon. I had her take him off and see if his eyes were open, she said he was chilling upside down on the top of the cage like 3 inches from the light with his eyes shut. She misted his leaves and then put him down on them because she doesn't think he's been drinking.

Another quick question, how much should such a little cham eat? I've only seen him eat like 6-8 crickets in a few days. They were all a little smaller than his head. Also, is it bad if I leave like 8 crickets in his cage with him for him to eat when he pleases? My girlfriend told me that when she put too many crickets in with her leopard gecko the crickets attacked him and from then on he was too afraid to eat them. The crickets leave my cham alone though so it seems okay so far.

Sorry for such a long post, I just don't want my beloved Rodriguez to die

Thank you all for your help!

Could it maybe also be that my room is too dry? When I soak all his leaves with mist it dries up within 5 minutes every time.

Aussie said:

I'm not sure because I'm out of town for the weekend, but I asked my mom to check on him and I'll let you know when she replies. Yeah I thought it was weird that he was keeping his eyes shut all the time, would it have been because his UVB light is too bright for him? The crickets had some potato when I got them and I gave them some apple slices too. I have calcium powder that I've been putting on the crickets, I think the brand is something like ReptiCal or RepCal? And I have the other thing to put on the crickets once a week, but I've only had him for a few days so I haven't given him that yet. I'm not sure about the lighting, but the place I got him from is a small shop that specializes in only reptiles. The guy who owns it is super helpful too and he seems like he knows what he's talking about. The packaging for the lights had chameleons on it too, so it's definitely for them at least. I'll update this tomorrow night with the exact type of lighting. I talked to my mom and she said that he's been climbing around more and has been sitting under his lights for a while. She also said that he's had his eyes open and that he's been hanging upside down from the top of the cage all afternoon. I had her take him off and see if his eyes were open, she said he was chilling upside down on the top of the cage like 3 inches from the light with his eyes shut. She misted his leaves and then put him down on them because she doesn't think he's been drinking. And no apologies for the long post! The more info you give us, the more we can help you!

Another quick question, how much should such a little cham eat? I've only seen him eat like 6-8 crickets in a few days. They were all a little smaller than his head. Also, is it bad if I leave like 8 crickets in his cage with him for him to eat when he pleases? My girlfriend told me that when she put too many crickets in with her leopard gecko the crickets attacked him and from then on he was too afraid to eat them. The crickets leave my cham alone though so it seems okay so far.

Sorry for such a long post, I just don't want my beloved Rodriguez to die

Thank you all for your help!

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Hanging upside is normal, but again with his eyes being shut, that is not. It is usually a sign that something is awry, either the lighting is wrong, or could be some type of illness. Don't leave any crickets in the cage that he does not eat over night. Yes, they can bite your chameleon while he is sleeping. A young chameleon can eat anywhere from15-25 crickets a day if they are small like 1/4 inch. If yours are bigger then he will eat less. I would ask the reptile store if your cham was closing his eyes prior to you taking him home. If you don't see him drink from the misting,it may be wise to get a dripper and run that for extra assurance that he is getting water. Sometimes chams are strange about drinking infront of people. You can tell if he is becoming dehydrated by his eyes and his urate(the whitish part of his poop) His eyes should not be sunken in looking and his urate should be white, not orange.

Okay, thank you! I think his crickets are more around 1/4-1/2 inch in size, but he is still able to get them down. I'll ask them first thing on monday morning. I had my mom put him in the bathroom after running the shower so that he was in a more humid environment in hopes he would absorb some of the water or be encouraged to drink. Is that okay? She also tried giving him a drop of water on her finger but he didn't do anything.

Should I raise the lights up? I already had them moved off to one side of his cage

you could try raising them up but you have to make sure that your basking light is not too high up that your temp drops too low. I just wish I knew what type of lights you were using specifically. Most people put their chameleons in the shower to drink. What you want to do is put your chameleon on a tall plant and turn on the shower and bounce the water off the wall onto the leaves, not directly onto the chameleon. You don't want the water to be hot as this is for drinking purposes if you are afraid your cham is getting dehydrated.

You could also have your mom unscrew the UVB light for a bit and see if his eyes stay open. If they do then that could very well be the problem. Most of us use the tube style light ( 5.0 reptisun) not a compact one. It also can not be for desert animals

Drip a droplet of water on his nose and see if he drinks that way also.

Hello everyone, I got a humidifier today and have turned the heat up to 75. I also got him a big waterfall and he's a lot more active today. I went and talked to the guy I bought him from and he told me that his uvb light was only 13w and that it should be fine for him all the time.

Here are a ton more pics of him if any of you want to check him out www.aandersonphoto.com/Other/Roger

People here are not big fans of waterfalls. They seem to attract the chameleon poop and that makes them bacteria problems. You'll be cleaning it every day if you want to keep your chameleon healthy.

Have you gotten a temperature in the basking spot? (6 inches below the roof, under the light would be a good place to measure) That's going to be what determines whether you move the lights up or not. It really should be around 81, maybe 82 degrees. If it's over that, raise the lights.

You don't want any lights at night, even the UVB.

Also, what sort of bulb is it? I ask because the board standard recommendation is the Repti-Sun 5.0 linear tube. 5.0 watts....so, 13 seems like a lot. An excess of UVB can cause them to shut their eyes. Excess UVB is what gives humans sunburns! It's definitely not something to mess around with.

The one that I got seems to work pretty well and stay clean. The guy who owns the store has one of the waterfalls in almost every cage and he wanted me to have one so that my little cham could drink whenever he needed. I had originally bought a small waterfall, but it had a leak so I returned it. The guy there didn't have any other small ones so he just gave me a large waterfall for free. The small ones were $40 and the big ones were $75, so he was pretty awesome and gave me $35 for no reason other than he wanted my chameleon to have a waterfall so idkkk.

I haven't taken a temp yet but he's been staying in the upper 2/3s of the cage about a foot from the lights and sometimes he goes down another foot or so and hides behind some leaves. He seems to have started to move around more and explore his cage. I set him at the base of the waterfall and he scoped out a cricket way up in the corner of his cage and crawled up the whole 3 feet and ate it right away. I think he's starting to get his strength back because the past couple days all he's done is huddle in one spot with his eyes closed. I held him today and his little feet were like tiny pinchers, before he had a super weak grip and I could barely feel him sitting on my finger. Before he would also shut his eyes within 10 seconds of holding him and he'd stop moving, but now he stays alert and his eyes look everywhere.

Yeah I've had the lights off every night. The bulb I have is a 13w exo terra Repti Glow 10.0uvb compact florescent and the basking lamp is a 100w exo terra. I asked the guy if maybe 13w was too much and maybe it was hurting his eyes and he told me that in the cage he has for the babies he has a 160w combo mercury bulb or something thats way stronger and that my little dude would be fine with the 13w one. He also said that they need a lot of uvb to digest their food and get the vitamins and what not so its good to have more. He assured me it wouldn't burn his eyes or make him blind.

I also asked him about room temp. Some people on here had said that 65ish was a good temp for night time and he said thats way too low. He told me the babies need low 70s at least. He said he keeps his store around 80 during the day and at night he puts the temp to 90 degrees. The humidifier helped a lot too, I've been keeping it at 60% humidity and Roger has been a lot more active. I think the main problem was that the air was just too dry for him and he was shriveling up like a raisin haha. I also discovered that he enjoys being misted with warm, almost hot water. Before when I would use room temp water he would run away like crazy and hide from all the water and never get a drink. When using warm water he'll sit on the wet leaves and take little sips for 10-15 minutes at a time.

I've noticed him rubbing his eyes on branches a few times, I asked the guy at the store and he said he probably just has a little piece of skin stuck in it and that it should work itself out. He still opens his eyes but he tends to keep his right eye shut sometimes. I've looked into his eye and theres not any obvious gunk or anything. Would using water from a water softener, with salt in it possibly be the cause of this? My mom told me the salt in the water might be making his eyes itchy or something so I've started to use filtered water from the fridge and heat it up in the microwave and then put it in his spray bottle to mist him.

One other thing, he seems super thin, as in I can see all of his ribs and everything. Is it bad if he's that skinny? He drank a bunch of water as I mentioned, and then his belly was nice and plump looking. He also ate 3 good size crickets with powder on them, 1 of them was pretty big and he had to munch on it for a few minutes but once he got it down he was noticeably fatter haha. When I was at the store today I saw what I assume was his sister (they arrived in the same shipping box on the same day) and she looked like 2 times the size of him and was almost fat so I'm not sure. Either way he seems a lot better now that I'm back from out of town, just wondering if its okay if they get that thin.

If anyone has any comments or advice on anything it'd be much appreciated!

Thanks!!

The problem could be the 10.0 UVB bulb. Most here use a 5.0. Especially with younger chams. The wattage is not the issue, it's the amount of UVB they put out.

Eye problems could also be caused by vitamin deficiencies. Your not supplementing with any vitamins and your not really gut loading your feeders with any either.

As already mentioned, waterfalls are not a good idea unless they are cleaned at least once a day.

At 1 month old he should be eating 10-15 crickets a day. It sounds like you may be given him crickets that are too big. The crickets should be no longer than the width between his eyes.

Also, pet store owners/workers are usually not the best source for proper chameleon care. Listen to the experienced users here on the forum.