Vit A Deficiencies - How Common?

[Zach Valois]

I am curious on just how prevalent vit a deficiencies are in captive chameleons. I think I have a seven month old male Nosey that is suffering from mild signs of such.

A little while back, Jim Flaherty was pretty sure another poster was describing a case of vit a deficiency in a six month old male panther. He spoke of it with some confidence and seemed to elude the problem is somewhat common in panthers.

So, just how common is it?

Is there a sticky or main thread somewhere for the tried and true basic supplementation regime for panthers/veileds (which I am assuming are the same). With all the debate, range of methods, and new supplements available, it all becomes quite muttled.

There must be something more to supplementation that I am catching on to, if my male Nosey is suffering from a vit a def.

Thanks,

Zach

 

[jannb]

This is a blog entry from Dr. Ivan Alfonso's blog. He is one of the best if not the best chameleon vets in the US.
http://www.ivanalfonso.com/2011/07/vitamin-a-supplement/

 

[Hoj]

I am curious on just how prevalent vit a deficiencies are in captive chameleons. I think I have a seven month old male Nosey that is suffering from mild signs of such.

A little while back, Jim Flaherty was pretty sure another poster was describing a case of vit a deficiency in a six month old male panther. He spoke of it with some confidence and seemed to elude the problem is somewhat common in panthers.

So, just how common is it?

Is there a sticky or main thread somewhere for the tried and true basic supplementation regime for panthers/veileds (which I am assuming are the same). With all the debate, range of methods, and new supplements available, it all becomes quite muttled.

There must be something more to supplementation that I am catching on to, if my male Nosey is suffering from a vit a def.

Thanks,

Zach

the vit a topic seems to be coming up alot latley as for a tried and true supplementing regime. there are a few. if vit is what you belive your cham may need, i would suggest a suppliment such as reptivite or repashy foods calcium plus both contain preformed vit a and i have great success with the use of preformed vit a with my animals.
some members ( including myself ) use drops from a vit a capsole on a feeder and seems to work great.

jmo
hoj

 

[Olimpia]

It's common enough, I think two of mine had a bit of it. Nothing that two doses from a Vit A gel capsule couldn't fix. But I'm switching over to the Rapashy all in one supplement as well, which has small amounts of Vit A so it should keep those symptoms at bay. I also have the Vit A liquid supplement from Dr. Alfonso, mentioned earlier, who sells it here in Florida. The fixes aren't difficult, it's just hard to maintain a good balance of that vitamin. Too much causes issues and too little does as well, so it's a fine balance.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I am curious on just how prevalent vit a deficiencies are in captive chameleons. I think I have a seven month old male Nosey that is suffering from mild signs of such.

A little while back, Jim Flaherty was pretty sure another poster was describing a case of vit a deficiency in a six month old male panther. He spoke of it with some confidence and seemed to elude the problem is somewhat common in panthers.

So, just how common is it?

Is there a sticky or main thread somewhere for the tried and true basic supplementation regime for panthers/veileds (which I am assuming are the same). With all the debate, range of methods, and new supplements available, it all becomes quite muttled.

There must be something more to supplementation that I am catching on to, if my male Nosey is suffering from a vit a def.

Thanks,

Zach

Id say it seems somewhat common, or rather not uncommon, on this forum. While I havent had trouble not using preformed vitamin A, it seems others sometimes do. I advocate you Pay attention to using a wide variety of feeders and gutloading well, so you are less likely to encounter an issue with any deficiency. Use a supplement product that contains retinol from time to time if you think that's the way to go with your animal in your situation.

what symptoms is your Nosey displaying?

Check out this blog entry (with links to threads on the topic you may find useful): https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/65-supplements.html

 

[Zach Valois]

Thanks for the input guys.

Sandra, thank you for the link. I will definitely go through that.

Vit A def is the only thing I can figure is bothering my Nosey. He is about seven months old. Typical setup, large screen, 8 hour drip, 75 watt bask bulb, 5.0 linear tube, etc etc. I maintain about 10 other panthers at this moment and will be be aquiring much more. All the other animals are fine. They are not exposed to drafts, other animals, no other clear trouble sources.
For the past two weeks or so, he has begun to close his eyes for periods throughout the day. If you disturb him, he opens his eyes pretty much all the way (very very slight squint). It started with one eye, and is now both. The lense and retina look generally normal, however the lid it self seems a slight bit loose. He still eats, drinks, basks, and is otherwise normal. His supplementation has been about rep W/d3 twice a once to twice a week, mult once a week to every other week. Yeah, this regime is proabably going to be flagged as improper, but I am changing this and the others are showing no signs of too much or too little of any particular element.

I just started the liquid retinol treatment today. I will see how this goes.

It's rather increadible though to really think about all the possible reasons a cham could close it's eyes. Talk about a challenge at times, I love chams!

Thanks!

 

[ChromaChameleons]

Zach is there any chance your UVB lamp has expired? You may have an issue with D3 or a Vit A /D3 ratio issue. What brand of UVB are you using ? What brand of supplements and your regime are you exercising?

 

[NORChameleons]

Interessting topic.

To understand our animals in captivity, we need to take a look at our animals in their natural habitat and their natural behaviour.
Several studies has shown that Furcifer pardalis is an oppertunistic predator, not a pure insectivore as some litterature and hobby herpetologists claim.
Based on my own field observations, and studies on feeding habits of F.pardalis in the wild, shows that the diet consists of some 10% other reptiles, including its own species.
Giving access to other reptiles as a source of prey in captivity will not only be benifitial to the lack of vitamin A in a pure insectivore diet, but also contribute to a diet closer to the chameleons natural diet.

I have always keept of culture of the parthenogenic gecko species Lepidodactylus lugubris to constantly have access to prey items. A group of 15 adult females will supply you with ~30 juveniles every 28 day.
These items are highly valued by the chameleons, especially with the gravid females who has a high demand for calsium.

 

[Takara]

I took one of my females to the vet today for a swelling near the eye (sinus infection)

we had a good talk about vit A, she said that every time she goes to reptile conferences, they keep mentioning a direct relation between eye problems and a vit A deficiency


enclosed is a picture of a copy she gave me, you have to zoom in to read it

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/551/p1000664v.jpg

it is from this book:

Reptile Medicine and Surgery [Hardcover]
Douglas R. Mader MS DVM

http://www.amazon.com/Reptile-Medic...TF8&coliid=I356K6GQJYYPYC&colid=2VIW6V94DDSXZ

 

[sandrachameleon]

Thanks for the input guys.
His supplementation has been about rep W/d3 twice a once to twice a week, mult once a week to every other week. Yeah, this regime is proabably going to be flagged as improper, but I am changing this and the others are showing no signs of too much or too little of any particular element.

Ya, that's more than many use. But what BRAND of vitamin powder? Does it contain Preformed vitamin A (retinol) or carotene?
What do you gutload with and what prey do you use?