Lost Little Elliott :(

dinomom

Chameleon Enthusiast
So sad to say that my little kinyongia boehmei passed away a couple of weeks ago. I did not want to post until I knew a little more.

Of course he passed on a Friday so I could not send him on ice, had to put into Formalin which meant they could identify presence of bacteria but not what type.

Final report from CA Animal Health & Food Safety Lab (CAHFS) is stomatitis and bacterial enteritis, the first which I expected based on his symptoms. He was literally eating the day before he died; on the last day I found him pale with eyes closed and examined the mouth which contained blood.

One always wants to know what happened in order to prevent it in the future. The only thing I can point to is about a month before there was a 4 day period where his air circulation fans were not going before I noticed it. This could have caused increased humidity and slightly increased warmth.

I knew he would be challenging, as a montane and very small species. When I "rescued" him from Petco I told myself if I could keep him healthy for a minimum of a year it was probably much better than he would have otherwise fared in a standard chameleon kit. He was in my care for a year and a half, and was at least 6 months old when I got him so he was geriatric and it is possible his immune system just failed.

My lesson going forward that we should all do is to examine the mouth once a month. Dale T showed me how to do this surprisingly easily with my meller's; turn them over on their back, brace your nondominant thumb against the nose, and gently

pull on the gular with the other hand to ease the mouth open. Pellinore
Lying in wait.jpg


will tolerate quite a good look and if he starts to bite down I reposition to hold it open better. I am doing this on the first of every month. Have not attempted on veiled yet :)

I miss this little beast so much, I still speak to him every time I pass the cage. I do rest better knowing I did everything literally in my power to give him the best life I possibly could and I hope he knew it.
 
So sad to say that my little kinyongia boehmei passed away a couple of weeks ago. I did not want to post until I knew a little more.

Of course he passed on a Friday so I could not send him on ice, had to put into Formalin which meant they could identify presence of bacteria but not what type.

Final report from CA Animal Health & Food Safety Lab (CAHFS) is stomatitis and bacterial enteritis, the first which I expected based on his symptoms. He was literally eating the day before he died; on the last day I found him pale with eyes closed and examined the mouth which contained blood.

One always wants to know what happened in order to prevent it in the future. The only thing I can point to is about a month before there was a 4 day period where his air circulation fans were not going before I noticed it. This could have caused increased humidity and slightly increased warmth.

I knew he would be challenging, as a montane and very small species. When I "rescued" him from Petco I told myself if I could keep him healthy for a minimum of a year it was probably much better than he would have otherwise fared in a standard chameleon kit. He was in my care for a year and a half, and was at least 6 months old when I got him so he was geriatric and it is possible his immune system just failed.

My lesson going forward that we should all do is to examine the mouth once a month. Dale T showed me how to do this surprisingly easily with my meller's; turn them over on their back, brace your nondominant thumb against the nose, and gently

pull on the gular with the other hand to ease the mouth open. Pellinore View attachment 326859

will tolerate quite a good look and if he starts to bite down I reposition to hold it open better. I am doing this on the first of every month. Have not attempted on veiled yet :)

I miss this little beast so much, I still speak to him every time I pass the cage. I do rest better knowing I did everything literally in my power to give him the best life I possibly could and I hope he knew it.
I'm really sorry for your loss. 🌺
 

Sonny13

Chameleon Enthusiast
Noooo, not Elliott as well 😢 I´m very, very sorry for your lost 🍀💚 at least he had the best 1.5 year he could get, I had that exact same feeling when I saw Ranjo and the worst part is he´s at that same age Elliot was and the Boehmei´s from @snitz427
They´re really special and I don´t like breeding chameleons, but I´m actually considering breeding Boehmei´s, because they´re so wonderful.
Good you did the necropsy and gave us feedback on the outcome, I think this is where this community is for, not only for trouble solving, but more important trouble prevention.
Again really sorry for lost and keep him close in your heart, I´m gonna miss him over here 🙏
 

Sonny13

Chameleon Enthusiast
All the sudden I'm sitting with a knot in my stomach, I belief I'm going through the same faith you both had 😢 And slowly start to know why he came back home!
The last 2 days he's slowing down a bit and basking a lot. And yesterday during bedtime and during night one leg was hanging (didn't found that strange at first), but now today he's again basking but now with one leg hanging and saw one front and back leg hanging. He just ate 2 small dubia's without hesitation, but I'm getting that terrible feeling right and know I've read about this behavior, only can't find it any more. Hopefully, I'm terrible wrong but I think he came for his final trusted resting place 🤞
He's now almost 2.5 years old.
 

dinomom

Chameleon Enthusiast
I hope replying here will reach everyone.
Noooo, not Elliott as well 😢 I´m very, very sorry for your lost 🍀💚 at least he had the best 1.5 year he could get, I had that exact same feeling when I saw Ranjo and the worst part is he´s at that same age Elliot was and the Boehmei´s from @snitz427
They´re really special and I don´t like breeding chameleons, but I´m actually considering breeding Boehmei´s, because they´re so wonderful.
Good you did the necropsy and gave us feedback on the outcome, I think this is where this community is for, not only for trouble solving, but more important trouble prevention.
Again really sorry for lost and keep him close in your heart, I´m gonna miss him over here 🙏
Yes I felt like he and Ranjo were brothers and I loved that you love him as much as I loved Elliott!
 

dinomom

Chameleon Enthusiast
All the sudden I'm sitting with a knot in my stomach, I belief I'm going through the same faith you both had 😢 And slowly start to know why he came back home!
The last 2 days he's slowing down a bit and basking a lot. And yesterday during bedtime and during night one leg was hanging (didn't found that strange at first), but now today he's again basking but now with one leg hanging and saw one front and back leg hanging. He just ate 2 small dubia's without hesitation, but I'm getting that terrible feeling right and know I've read about this behavior, only can't find it any more. Hopefully, I'm terrible wrong but I think he came for his final trusted resting place 🤞
He's now almost 2.5 years old.
Try not to despair-there MIGHT be a chance some of this is normal behavior for them. About once every month or two ever since I had him, Elliott would do this. Never the front legs, but on occasion a back leg just dangling off. It really scared me at first, but it was not like he was too weak to use the leg, more like he was too lazy to use it. It could be either leg, and then he would use it totally normally once he moved. Wish I had taken a pic. I did wonder if it had anything to do with supplementation, but now I really wonder..I wonder if @snitz427 ever saw this? If so I'd be ready to call it a typical behavior.

You are right, though he is probably quite senior now. My gut feeling is that assuming there is no cancer (which there was not in Elliott, they checked sections of liver, spinal cord, vertebral column, stomach ,esophagus, limbs, bone marrow, oral cavity, trachea, lung, heart, spleen, kidney, pancreas, testis, eye globe and lens, and skeletal muscle!) then their immune system starts to fail and they succumb to normal environmental bacteria or pathogens.

I think you would get a lot of joy out of breeding and more people could enjoy this breed.
 

dinomom

Chameleon Enthusiast
I just wanted to thank each and every one of you for your kind words. In the wild, this little guy would have just been a snack for a bird or snake, a prey/food species. But on this forum and among all of you wonderful like-minded people, he was a beautiful little individual soul with his own personality every bit as deserving of living a long and fulfilling life as any other creature on earth. It is both humbling and an honor to know that such compassionate people as you exist. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
 

snitz427

Chameleon Enthusiast
Occassionally all my chams might get a little lazy and “sploot” for a short time, but its short lived and not repeated.

If he is continually avoiding the same leg I would suspect either gout (look for swelling or puffiness around joints) or sores on their feet. Its easy to check for sores. A little dirt is normal but raw sores may mean that the branches are staying too wet and his feet don't get to dry out. Or a possible abrasion.
 

Sonny13

Chameleon Enthusiast
Try not to despair-there MIGHT be a chance some of this is normal behavior for them. About once every month or two ever since I had him, Elliott would do this. Never the front legs, but on occasion a back leg just dangling off. It really scared me at first, but it was not like he was too weak to use the leg, more like he was too lazy to use it. It could be either leg, and then he would use it totally normally once he moved. Wish I had taken a pic. I did wonder if it had anything to do with supplementation, but now I really wonder..I wonder if @snitz427 ever saw this? If so I'd be ready to call it a typical behavior.

You are right, though he is probably quite senior now. My gut feeling is that assuming there is no cancer (which there was not in Elliott, they checked sections of liver, spinal cord, vertebral column, stomach ,esophagus, limbs, bone marrow, oral cavity, trachea, lung, heart, spleen, kidney, pancreas, testis, eye globe and lens, and skeletal muscle!) then their immune system starts to fail and they succumb to normal environmental bacteria or pathogens.

I think you would get a lot of joy out of breeding and more people could enjoy this breed.

Occassionally all my chams might get a little lazy and “sploot” for a short time, but its short lived and not repeated.

If he is continually avoiding the same leg I would suspect either gout (look for swelling or puffiness around joints) or sores on their feet. Its easy to check for sores. A little dirt is normal but raw sores may mean that the branches are staying too wet and his feet don't get to dry out. Or a possible abrasion.

Thank you for reply. Supplementation could be the problem, because he missed it for 7 weeks. Lets hope it´s an accidental thing and things will settle down within a few days. The bugs I fed him yesterday where dusted with multivitamin, so hopefully this will do the trick.

Also when I came close to his leg yesterday to touch it for a reaction, he started to nob his head, like they normally do against females. Maybe he is in his period and that´s what is bothering him.

Keep you posted.
 

Sonny13

Chameleon Enthusiast
I just wanted to thank each and every one of you for your kind words. In the wild, this little guy would have just been a snack for a bird or snake, a prey/food species. But on this forum and among all of you wonderful like-minded people, he was a beautiful little individual soul with his own personality every bit as deserving of living a long and fulfilling life as any other creature on earth. It is both humbling and an honor to know that such compassionate people as you exist. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Happy I Love You GIF by Life of a Potato
 
Top Bottom