Egg texture change during incubation

[Olimpia]

I know I've seen threads like this, but a Google search of the forum hasn't turned up much.

Today I was taking photos of my panther clutch and I noticed that the largest egg has tiny crackling lines. Very faint and very thin lines, and the cracks form little squares, like when you drop an egg and it tends to crack in little shapes. The others do not have these shapes, but they are starting to show lines as well. I would take photos but there's no way the macro on my camera can handle that much faint detail.

They turned 5 months old this past week, and are incubating at 76-77*F.

I suppose my question is, how will the texture of the eggs continue to change throughout the remaining incubation time? Are these cracks the beginning of the windows I've heard talk about? I understand that they will eventually sweat, shrink, and hatch. Will they look white the whole time or get transparency patches, like I've seen on other eggs?

Thanks in advance.

Here are photos of the clutch now. The one yellowish egg at the bottom is a single egg she dropped a couple weeks ago following an infertile clutch a few weeks prior. I'm waiting on it to probably go bad.

US Quarter to compare the size.

Euro 50c coint to compare (for the European members.)

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

I have no answers for you. But all those eggs are so precious! I want to breed Oscar really bad. I'm going to be looking for a sweet ambilobe female in the next month or two for him. I want eggs and babies!!

 

[Dez]

Some of mine get these cracks in them al well.. I even had some large veiled eggs seem to "shed" its outer egg shell skin. I though maybe because of the growth of the eggs but I am not sure.

Windowing is different. Its when the egg seems to get more transparent toward the end of incubation. That doesn't always happen though

 

[Olimpia]

Thanks! I can't tell you how ready I am to have these guys hatch. I tried to ignore them the first 4 months but now I'm getting super excited, since I think it's about time to get the baby set-ups ready!

It's really fun looking for a mate to a male, and then the whole process that follows until you get eggs. Plus females are adorable, I am so in love with mine!

 

[Olimpia]

Thanks Dez. And you see it towards the end of incubation?
And that's super interesting that you had eggs shed! That must have been a surprise to see!

 

[Dez]

Most of my eggs take 7 months to hatch with no dipause .

Have you tried to candle any? You will know when they are just about ready to hatch when you candle them and the bottom of the egg is solid with no light passing through and the top is clear and lit up. Almost like the egg is divided in half with the bottom being dark and the top being light

I have tried to take pictures of candled eggs but its so hard to get a good photo

 

[Dez]

Thanks Dez. And you see it towards the end of incubation?
And that's super interesting that you had eggs shed! That must have been a surprise to see!

I think is was about 5 months in. The veiled eggs got really large. I was thinking "what the heck?" It was a very very thin layer of egg shell. it still had a strong white eggshell underneath. All the babies hatched out no problems at about 7 months

 

[Kent67]

Some eggs never show the lines or cracking before they hatch. I'm a bit puzzled by how similiar in size the 5 month eggs are to the 2 week infertile one. With the cracking you're seeing I'd assume they're quite a bit into development after diapause but you may have some itty-bitty babies when they do hatch. Otherwise, if they've just come out of it now (constant 76-77F?) it could be a while and the eggs will grow considerably and get more oval-shaped.

 

[Kent67]

Most of my eggs take 7 months to hatch with no dipause .

This is also interesting. I assume you're not using an incubator and just "closeting" them? Seems to be a Florida thing I've heard. I started doing that here and I have crazy hatch times. From clutches hatching at 6 months to some Ambilobes that are hatching right now at 13-14 months.

 

[Olimpia]

Most of my eggs take 7 months to hatch with no dipause .

Have you tried to candle any? You will know when they are just about ready to hatch when you candle them and the bottom of the egg is solid with no light passing through and the top is clear and lit up. Almost like the egg is divided in half with the bottom being dark and the top being light

I have tried to take pictures of candled eggs but its so hard to get a good photo

No, I haven't tried. Are you candling them from one of the ends?

Some eggs never show the lines or cracking before they hatch. I'm a bit puzzled by how similiar in size the 5 month eggs are to the 2 week infertile one. With the cracking you're seeing I'd assume they're quite a bit into development after diapause but you may have some itty-bitty babies when they do hatch. Otherwise, if they've just come out of it now (constant 76-77F?) it could be a while and the eggs will grow considerably and get more oval-shaped.

It's been pretty constant. We've had a few days where it's gotten cooler or warmer but the great majority of the time they're at 76-77.

The infertile egg was a big of a mystery because early in April she laid a clutch of eggs that quickly molded over, but she had one lump left in her side. Then, about mid-May she dropped this one egg finally. She didn't have any others, I had her checked. So maybe this egg is bigger because it was in her longer? It had to be part of that second clutch, but it took an extra month to come out.

 

[Dez]

This is also interesting. I assume you're not using an incubator and just "closeting" them? Seems to be a Florida thing I've heard. I started doing that here and I have crazy hatch times. From clutches hatching at 6 months to some Ambilobes that are hatching right now at 13-14 months.

Yes we just put them in the closet. Temps range from 72 to 78. All the panther and veiled eggs take about 7 months to hatch.. I think the longest one was 9 month.

Veileds usually all hatch within 3 days of the first one pipping. My panthers usually trickle out one or two at a time over about a month.

Carpet eggs on the other hand have taken 6 months to 12 months hatch using the same method. We have had one egg from a clutch hatch at 7mo and the rest not start hatching till 10 months - same clutch.

 

[Dez]

No, I haven't tried. Are you candling them from one of the ends?



I take a LED pen light and put it on top of the eggs just how they lay in the container. I don't take them out of the container. The light will light up the egg like a little globe. You may have to go in a darken room to see .

A solid will start to form about where they are sitting in the media. You may have to brush the vermiculite aside a little to see the side of the egg.

 

[Kent67]

So maybe this egg is bigger because it was in her longer? It had to be part of that second clutch, but it took an extra month to come out.

Well, yeah, that wouldn't surprise me. I had a female do something similar and when the retained eggs finally came out they were bigger than their incubating counterparts.

Yes we just put them in the closet.

It's sure starting to seem to me like there's more than just temperature variation influencing hatch times. My temps here are similar but I have these large fluctuations in incubation length. When I keep them at the constant 76-77 I get more predictable 7 month hatch times with most clutches. Weird.

 

[pssh]

I don't know if anyone mentioned it, but I've read that the cracking is from growing and absorbing calcium. I can't remember who said it though.