Decreased fat pads on casque

tdotcham

tdotcham

New Member
I've been following my cham and am curious on if there are any implications that could lead to the decrease of his fat pads on his casque. He seems otherwise alright, however I have yet to see him with his casque this small. I had earlier been focusing on not feeding him as much as I had been, and was focusing on around 4 feeders around every other day and sometimes daily. Previously he had been given around 6-8 feeders daily.

He sits at the proper basking temperatures around 85*, reptiglo 5.0 bulb, following a dusting schedule of calcium w/o daily, rotated with reptivite with d3 2 times a week. He runs on a mistking, as well as a dripper, his urates are never perfect and hes tough to get drinking. I find the tip of the urate to always seem to be orange followed by white. Hes very active, always eats immediately, and has great grip. I just want to ensure he doesn't have signs of a bacteria or parasite that would develop and require treatment until I get a fecal float done or if the casque decrease is just due to a change in feeders. The only change I can say is that I have stopped with superworm snacks as of lately and stuck to the staple diet... planning on introducing some higher fat into his diet.

Pictures from march:
5505966807_72efd0d6ce.jpg

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5506533342_cef20a1955.jpg



Pictures from this week:
IMG_0866.jpg

IMG_0865.jpg

http://s470.photobucket.com/albums/rr61/woodsball_delight/?action=view&current=IMG_0315-1.mp4 video of him after eating a cricket.


the pictures/video arent the best... damn iphone camera. I'll work on getting some better ones but you can see the clear difference. Aside from that, I notice no difference in him.
 
He is thin! You can see the bones in his arms too. Not sure that putting him on diet should cause that much fat mobilization that quickly. Has he had a fecal to check for parasites?
 
try giving him some freshly molted mealworms (still white)thier less of a threat to the digestive track. idt a pinky would be a good recomendation but maybe someone more knowledged then myself can make a better suggestion.
idk u could up his crix to i guess. no offense but usually thier arms look muscular. your chams arms have little but like some said above they do look more like bone. other than i say that is a VERY beautifuly colored chameleon.
 
Wow, Ferret I agree, that is a dramatic weight change
Much too thin, and in 5 months.
I would start adding fat/nutrition back into his diet and do a fecal and maybe subque hydration is in order
Keep us posted, ok?
anne
 
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Waxworms, butter worms, silkworms, and hornworms would all be good additions to his diet. Waxworms in particular have high fat content but you don't just need fat here, he needs more nutrition in general imo.
 
Thanks for the replies. I am planning on readding the superworms/silks back to him, just havent bought them the last couple rounds of getting crickets. He eats tons, in the past week and a half I have upped to giving him around 6-8 crickets daily which he eats no problem.

In terms of arms, he has always had smaller arms. I have no doubt that he has lost weight, I am trying to pin point what could case this. I think there is a general disregard of weight when naturally wild compared to being captive, as most over feed compared to naturally what they would be able to consume. Would a parasite cause weight loss? Lack of D3?

I'm hoping some of the more experienced keepers are able to come in and chime as well.
 
large crickets are the staple... the decrease of 4 feeders everyday/everyother day was utilized by many keepers here and I wanted to mimic a more natural diet for him. It may have been a poor choice, but I think this is more of a sudden weight loss that I noticed more recently and am now working to battle. it's difficult when you see them everyday to notice a weight loss.

As for the internal bacteria, that could be a cause. I inspected his feces closely two days ago, and noticed a partial part of a non fully digested cricket. Reading your blog you had a mixed solution, however what other medication could he go on?
 
Parasite burden can cause weight loss. Other ailments can cause weight loss too like infection, renal or liver disease or cancer. Usually you see other signs of organ dysfunction but that degree of weight loss in that period of time is very concerning. From the first pics his arms look much skinnier than they used to. I would get a fecal done and if you want to go all the way I'd get bloodwork too. It may give you an idea of an underlying disease process. Or it may be normal, which would still tell you something.

A vitamin deficiency should not cause significant weight loss imo. That comes from malnutrition (doesn't really sounds like it), malabsorption (either a disease process or inadequate basking temps - I would raise his basking temp a little), overwhelming parasite burden, or an underlying disease process (organ dysfunction or cancer) as my most likely differentials. For this to be going on so long with no other signs a bacterial infection seems less likely, but maybe still possible. It's hard to say at this point...
 
hmm, that leaves me in a strange position. He just had a poop, so it may leave me 1-2 weeks to have a fresh fecal for examination. If he needs treatment, I want to act fast.
 
still waiting on a poop so I can go ahead with a fecal.

Ive been feeding him 5-6 crickets daily along with a silkworm and 2 wax worms. I also replaced the UV and upped the temperature in his basking spot a couple degrees.

I've been reading on the different parasites, and the one that comes to mind in terms of weight loss is coccidia.
 
ferretinmyshoes said:
Parasite burden can cause weight loss. Other ailments can cause weight loss too like infection, renal or liver disease or cancer. Usually you see other signs of organ dysfunction but that degree of weight loss in that period of time is very concerning. From the first pics his arms look much skinnier than they used to. I would get a fecal done and if you want to go all the way I'd get bloodwork too. It may give you an idea of an underlying disease process. Or it may be normal, which would still tell you something.

A vitamin deficiency should not cause significant weight loss imo. That comes from malnutrition (doesn't really sounds like it), malabsorption (either a disease process or inadequate basking temps - I would raise his basking temp a little), overwhelming parasite burden, or an underlying disease process (organ dysfunction or cancer) as my most likely differentials. For this to be going on so long with no other signs a bacterial infection seems less likely, but maybe still possible. It's hard to say at this point...
Click to expand...

I agree with this.
 
I've seen this happen with panther chameleons that are not fed enough or are dehydrated. The male panthers seem to need quite a bit of food to keep them in good condition. These pads will also sink in like that when the panther is getting to be very old...don't know if their appetite declines or if their ability to digest food and absorb nutrients might be part of it then.

Not saying that there couldn't be another reason for the weight loss...but you did put him on a diet. :)
 
Diet meaning I just controlled the feeding, I did not starve him. His appetite is still very great, as for hydration... I have been utilizing a mist king for about a month and a half as well as running a dripper throughout the day. I'm not sure how more to hydrate him other than forcing him water.

I will be picking up reptaid tomorrow... and administering that until I can him to poop. Today I completely gutted the cage, eliminated all the plastic leaves/foliage, sprayed the two plants down with soapy water and rinsed the leaves clean, cleaned the plant pots along with the cage with water/vinegar.
 
diets some suggest on here are a little weak imo and dont work on each individual chameleon. feed the guy as much as he wants. if you see him getting fat back off a little until you find his sweet spot. he will lose weight much faster than he will gain :)

its worth looking into him possibly having a intestinal/stomach bacterial problem. it wont hurt to try.

good luck and please keep us updated.
 
They should do a fecal float and smear (make sure they do both) because parasite eggs will come up on the float but coccidia and bacterial or yeast infection will only come up on the smear.
 
okay, Im in the process of trying to get the best herp vet in my area (seems to be a pain like many other areas).

Is there anything special other than dosage size with Reptaid that I should be worried about? Should I be forcing hydration as well??? Maybe purchase a bunch more of silk worms
 
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