Banning Snakes in the USA

jojackson

New Member
just received the following email from Dave Barker in the USA. I think the implications are self explanatory ...

" I've never before sent an email out to everyone in my contacts list, but never before has there been such need.

A proposed law, identified as "S 373", as currently written will end possession, transport, and commerce for all pythons and boas in the USA. This law will immediately put Tracy and I out of business and destroy all that we have accomplished working with pythons and boas in our careers. The bill will be voted on by the committee tomorrow, so this is very last minute and urgent.

Today is the last day we can get emails or calls in to the committee, the media, and the White House, and request that they stop, or at least amend this unfounded and insane law, written and supported by the HSUS, a rabid animal-rights group.

Below is a message from USARK, the national organization that represents and supports reptile keepers and their rights. We are asking for you to read the message and then do any of the three actions listed. At least send off the two emails (one to the White House and one to the media), very easy and quick to do if you click on the two links provided.

Look at the list of senators on the committee. If any are from your state, then please call him/her and ask that this bill not be passed. It will confiscate property rights from Americans, destroy small businesses, destroy one of the most successful conservation projects ever accomplished by private citizens, and cause millions of animals to be destroyed.

Tracy and I are in disbelief that this has come to pass. We are asking you to please help with our cause.

Thank you,

Dave Barker"

7/8/2009 - Update on Senate Bill S. 373

http://www.rainforest-pets.com/s373-update2.htm
 
A little off topic - but this is one of the many reasons why I am so opposed to breed specific legislation and the banning of pit bulls. They start with dogs, they're making their way towards snakes, whats next? Hamsters? This is clearly getting out of hand. Fingers crossed that this bill goes no where, and fast.
 
By the way - do you mind if I cross post this on a few other forums? Try to spread the word as quickly as possible?
 
I think it should be limited to permits. Not a permit to own them but a permit per each snake.
 
ban everything, that will solve the problem:rolleyes:

BTW how many of the horribly invasive pythons have they caught? zero. The one guy that said he trapped one got busted for setting it up. Unlike Guam there are enough predators here to cull the majority of the pythons. Now if the alligators will just be left alone long enough to eat more green iguanas everything will be gravy :D
 
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I can understand their reasoning, but not the ban... There are a lot of ignorant people releasing large snakes into the wild and I'm sure we can all agree that they will eventually (if not already) take a toll on the natural eco system of the areas. I don't think a ban will fix things, just like it hasn't fixed anything in regards to the banning of pit bulls, its a band aid situation that is going to do little more than prevent the responsible owners from acquiring and safely keeping their pets.
 
Unfortunately this bill is being held up by a USGS report that is being touted by the USFWS as "peer-reviewed science." The truth of the matter is, however, it is not peer-reviewed, is not based on unbiased science, is overly simplistic and has been disproven by more advanced and rigorous studies that did go through actual peer-review. Here is a letter outlining the issues with this report that was sent to congress by an independent scientific panel that reviewed the report:

"Letter To Congress:
24 November 2009
U.S. House of Representatives Committee on the Judiciary
The Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism & Homeland Security
2138 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
Dear Chairman Bobby Scott and Ranking Member Louie Gohmert:
We write in regard to the recent Congressional hearing on HR 2811. As scientists who have worked with reptiles including those cited in HR2811, we express our reservations regarding the document recently released by USGS as an “Open-Report”, titled Giant Constrictors: Biological and Management Profiles and an Establishment Risk Assessment for Nine Large Species of Pythons, Anacondas, and the Boa Constrictor.
Simply put, this report is not a bona-fide “scientific” paper that has gone through external peer review. Part of this report is fact-driven, described by the authors as “traditional library scholarship.” By the authors’ admissions, there are surprisingly little data available regarding the natural history of these species. In their attempt to compile as much information as possible, the authors draw from a wide variety of references, ranging from articles published in peer-reviewed professional journals to far less authoritative hobbyist sources, including popular magazines, the internet, pet industry publications, and even various media sources. While such an approach is inclusive, it tends to include information that is unsubstantiated and, in some cases, contradicts sound existing data.
As scientists whose careers are focused around publishing in peer-reviewed journals and providing expert reviews of papers submitted to these journals, we feel it is a misrepresentation to call the USGS document “scientific”. In fact, much of this report is based on an unproven risk assessment model that produces results that contradict the findings presented in a recently published scientific paper that used a more complex and superior model (see: Pyron R.A., F.T. Burbrink, and T.J. Guiher. 2008. Claims of Potential Expansion throughout the U.S. by Invasive Python Species Are Contradicted by Ecological Niche Models, PLoS One 3: e2931. doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0002931). Unfortunately, the authors of the USGS document limit their reference to this scientific work to an unsubstantiated criticism. To the contrary, this alternate model is validated by its relatively accurate prediction of the natural distribution of the species in question (something the USGS model does not even attempt). Furthermore, despite its conclusion of a limited potential distribution of Burmese pythons in the United States, the model presented by Pyron et al. accurately predicts the presence of Burmese pythons in the Everglades.
The USGS model likely provides a gross overestimate of potential habitat for these snake species. People throughout the United States keep pythons as pets, yet the only known breeding populations in the United States are in the Everglades. Such a wide distribution of potential sources of invasion, but only a localized invasive event, suggests that factors beyond those used in the USGS model are critical to limiting the suitability of habitat for pythons. The authors even state that climate is only one factor of several that affect the distribution of an animal, yet they develop a model that only uses overly simplistic climatic data (e.g., the climatic data did not take seasonality into consideration).
We are further concerned by the pervasive bias throughout this report. There is an obvious effort to emphasize the size, fecundity and dangers posed by each species; no chance is missed to speculate on negative scenarios. The report appears designed to promote the tenuous concept that invasive giant snakes are a national threat. However, throughout the report there is a preponderance of grammatical qualifiers that serve to weaken many, if not most, statements that are made.
We fully recognize the serious concerns associated with the presence of persistent python populations in southern Florida. As top predators, these animals can and will have a dramatic impact on the community of wildlife that lives in the Everglades. Inaccurately extending this threat to a much large geographic area is not only inappropriate, but likely takes needed focus away from the real problem in the Everglades.
In conclusion, as written, this document is not suitable as the basis for legislative or regulatory policies, as its content is not based on best science practices, it has not gone through external peer-review, and it diverts attention away from the primary concern. We encourage the USFWS and USGS to submit this document to an independent body for proper and legitimate peer review. Additionally, we encourage the Committee to review this document, not as an authoritative scientific publication, but rather as a report currently drafted to support a predetermined policy.
Signed:
Elliott Jacobson, MS, DVM, PhD, Dipl. ACZM
Professor of Zoological Medicine
University of Florida
Dale DeNardo, DVM, PhD
Associate Professor School of Life Sciences
Arizona State University
Paul M. Gibbons, DVM, MS, Dipl. ABVP (Avian)
President-Elect, Association of Reptilian and Amphibian Veterinarians
Interim Regent, Reptiles & Amphibians, American Board of Veterinary Practitioners
Director, Exotic Species Specialty Service
Animal Emergency Center and Specialty Services
Chris Griffin, DVM, Dipl. ABVP (Avian)
President, Association of Reptilian and Amphibian Veterinarians
Owner and Medical Director
Griffin Avian and Exotic Veterinary Hospital
Brady Barr, PhD
Resident Herpetologist
National Geographic Society
Endangered Species Coalition of the Council of State Governments
Crocodilian Specialist Group
Warren Booth, PhD
Invasive Species Biologist
Research Associate
North Carolina State University
Director of Science
United States Association of Reptile Keepers
Ray E. Ashton, Jr.
President
Ashton Biodiversity Research & Preservation Institute
Robert Herrington, PhD
Professor of Biology
Georgia Southwestern State University
Douglas L. Hotle
Curator of Herpetology/Conservation/Research
Natural Toxins Research Center
Texas A&M University
Francis L. Rose (Retired) , B.S., M.S. (Zoology), PhD (Zoology)
Professor Emeritus
Texas State University
Edward J. Wozniak DVM, PhD
Regional Veterinarian
Zoonosis Control Division
Texas Department of State Health Services
CC: Secretary Kenneth Salazar, US Dept of the Interior; Director Marcia McNutt, US Geological Survey; Director Sam Hamilton, US Fish & Wildlife Service"

Unfortunately, this bill has been passed by the senate committee today and will be going to the senate floor for a vote...

Chris
 
I have to Agree L30girl, as I understand it, this one bans the import/export between states (and possibly breeding) but not ownership. I fail to see that will keep them out of the everglades and elsewhere.
Whenever you prohibit something, you push it underground. Breeding will continue, and due fear of a bust (or for the same reasons as now) dumping will continue.
This bill has stirred fears of similar legislation on this side of the pond too. We are the minority here, and therefor much more vulnerable to kneejerk legislations like this one.
I see alot of $ lost over there, buisnesses bankrupt.
From what I understand, this bloke is now aiming at all other exotic species.
 

The neighborhood released reptile is not the same as the " masses " that are supposedly " in the everglades " So I'll stick with the number that the licensed trappers have caught.

Having lived and hunted in florida for almost four decades I tend to follow and investigate the claims of fish and wildlife down here as they are just another government body that tend to exaggerate an issue so they can get more money in next years budget.
 
Hell no, am I giving up any of my reptiles.

The best thing to do is find out which flight this florida senator is boarding, give Samuel Jackson a ticket to the same plane. Let nature take its course.

"Im tired of these motha F##king snakes on this motha F##king plane!"
 
I don't own any snakes, but I am happy that I am in Canada for the reason that I don't think this proposed law will come North of the border due to the fact that I doubt a large constrictor could survive a Canadian winter, although I wouldn't be surprised if there have been a few less than intelligent people who have thrown their snakes out to fend for themselves.

No matter what they do, I think the snakes will be released into the wild because there will always be another ignorant snake owner (or any animal owner for that matter) that just doesn't care. If they become illegal, that may just intrigue some of the less than reptile savvy and reptile responsible (I guess I can say that?) people to keep them, and like was mentioned, if they are at risk of being caught, they'll be released. Its a vicious cycle.
 
Montium, Ive seen dozens of storys with images, of police taking them off the roads in florida. Clearly they are out there. Any is more than zero. 38-39 claimed caught in one link above. I dont doubt numbers are exagerrated by those with an agenda, but saying, none, its all lies is just ignorant. Escaped or released, what difference does that make,
their issue is the potential to breed and thrive in the wild.

Burmese Pythons breed in the early spring, with females laying clutches which average 12–36 eggs in March or April

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burmese_Python

reported 12 hrs ago..

http://www.wltx.com/news/story.aspx?storyid=81705&catid=35

Cant find the story from the image below. I dont think its his pet.

python_1.jpg


From wikipedia link above

800px-Gator_and_Python.jpg

An American alligator and a Burmese python locked in a struggle to prevail in Everglades National Park.

Date 20 February 2008

Author Lori Oberhofer, National Park Service
 
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