Urgent - Yemen Shaking

Hello everybody,

I say urgent not because I feel the cham is in great danger at the moment but because I am supposed to be purchasing him tomorrow and I dont want to spend £80 for a sick cham.

I am looking to buy the £80 18 month old yemen male, but when I saw him in the shop today there were a few things I noticed, (I am new to chameleons and reptiles btw), first he was in a small enclosure that was not high, he was waist level in the room, and he only had 2-3 branches to climb on! but most importantly he was occasionally shaking a bit. I know that this could be a sign of MBD but could it be anything else? he was not in a very hot part of the enclosure and i think he was a bit cold, but i only saw him shake once or twice in the 20 mins we were there (and didnt notice any double elbows/floppy legs), she took him out (she had to drag him out almost) and gave him to me (first time holding cham) but then he started climbing all over me and crawling up and up my arms to keep trying to get to my shoulders where he then eventually settled on the back of my neck (so cute! knew then i liked him so much!) where i spent about 5mins talking to the shop owner with him perched on the back of my neck. (also while i was there i didnt notice him changing colour too much even when being dragged out of his cage, should he have been changing colour alot? he stayed a fairly bright light green all the time)

anyway sorry for waffling, i guess what im asking is, is this shaking bad? is it mbd? or is it because he was cold or something? could it be recovered easily? she said he spent his life so far in that enclosure (so he seems pretty hardy) and if i get him i would give him a much bigger taller one with lots and lots of climbing things, but anyway what do you guys think? also what do you think about the price? and do you think i should get a younger one than 18months so i dont miss out on them being smaller and seeing them grow up (as i imagine thats pretty special)? How long do they live for on average?

sorry again for waffling!!! =)

and sorry if this isnt correct forum im new! thought clinic was best for shaking advice!

Thanks,

Jon.

Kind of depends on what you mean by shaking.
Rocking side to side or step to step is normal and a defensive and communication mechanism.
head nodding is also normal.
Trembling is not and can be related to calcium deficiency or other problems and the lizard is best avoided.
They also sometimes "vibrate" for a second or two when being held or on the branch. This is also a communication tool- they send vibrations out along the twigs and branches they are on.
But trembling or twitching of an isolated limb especially- not normal.

green is good for colouration by the way.

Oh and sometimes if both eyes are focused on a prey item or just when excited babies sometimes twitch a bit. Usually followed by rapid movement of the animal towards or away from the thing exciting it. that would also be normal.

Hey flux, thanks for the response.
it definitely wasn't rocking, he didnt do any rocking at all while i was with him and he was climbing all over me (is that strange? lol so paranoid), your comment about the communication makes me think thats what it could be as he sort vibrated on his legs while we were all around his cage, but im just scared its mbd as the shop didnt seem like the most caring place. what do you think on the price also? On top of this they said they could do a full setup with everything i needed in a 60x45x90cm exo terra for £330.

Other opions welcome too guys, more the merrier =)

Jon

well, without being there, I can't say for certain, but-

colouring sounds good.

can you get the lizard to feed in front of you? Do you know the sex for certain?

If he's an eager feeder, and the "shaking" only lasted a second or two, probably he is OK to go, then just carefully keep up on supplementation and proper lighting at home.

Pricing- I don't know, sorry. I'm in the USA- not sure the value of things where you are...

AdmiralSwanson said:

Hey flux, thanks for the response.
it definitely wasn't rocking, he didnt do any rocking at all while i was with him and he was climbing all over me (is that strange? lol so paranoid), your comment about the communication makes me think thats what it could be as he sort vibrated on his legs while we were all around his cage, but im just scared its mbd as the shop didnt seem like the most caring place. what do you think on the price also? On top of this they said they could do a full setup with everything i needed in a 60x45x90cm exo terra for £330.

Other opions welcome too guys, more the merrier =)

Jon

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Hi welcome to the forum. Can you list what you are getting for£330 as pet shops are famed for selling substrate, waterfalls and basking lights to name a few.

Ok thanks flux =)

Hi kate, and i cant list exactly what I would get as i cant remember, i should have taken i picture! but it was all the lighting in the exo terra compact hood thing, thermometer and humidity measurer (cant remember technical name haha) and i would get to mix and match lots of foliage and a big dripper thats all i can remember at the moment sorry its not very helpful, what do you think about the price of the cham? should i get a younger one? and what do you think about the shaking/vibrating?

At 18 months you will have an adult veiled. I wonder how he has been looked after and where he has been for 18months. Can you get a photo? It's good that he is friendly, he must have been handled. I'm not sure about the shaking. Chams don't shake when cold like we do. £80 sounds ok. They have a characteristic walk that involves a bit of shaking, you might find it on YouTube. It's called the leaf walk. As far as equipment goes check here if it is correct before buying. Have you read the care sheets on here? They are up to date and very good.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/chameleons/

Yeh I know they are adult at 18months, which is one of my concrens, A that i will not have him for as long as i can and B that i will miss the fun of seeing a youngen grow up to an adult under my care. Another shop said that they would give me a ring if they got some in, but they said they were usually around 4 months or less, would that be too young to risk looking after as a new chameleon owner? As for the shaking its not the leaf walk, he vibrated/shaked for a second at his shoulders but this only happened once or maybe twice in the 20mins or so i was there, i just wondered if it was serious or could have been some other kind of behavior? Ill try and go back tomorrow and get a picture, or video or something as the deal isnt set in stone and i dont think they will mind if i said there were others i were considering. So the main questions im really asking really are:

Is the 1 or 2 shakes I saw after 20mins a bad thing which i shouldnt buy the cham for?
and Should i be looking to get a younger one than 18months to enjoy watching it grow up and if so how young do people advise I should go?

As a new Cham owner 4 months is a good age. Any younger is risky. I can't advise about the shake. Pics will help.

ok, thanks very much for your help =) ill try get some pics and a video =) cheers

I purchased my first cham as an adult and I loved him very much. I think as a new owner (first cham) I was more comfortable with an adult. I got my second cham as a baby (about 3mos) thinking that he would be friendlier but once he turned 6 months all bets were off. He started hissing and trying to bite me when taking him out of the cage, he runs away etc. They are not especially social animals to begin with.

so was your adult really friendly then?? and for your young one, how often did you handle him?

No my adult was not especially friendly, but I could handle him. Both really hated being taken out but once out they are OK. I handled the baby every day, but once he started getting aggressive I have backed off and take him out a couple times a week. As much as I love holding him and handling him, they are just not that into it. Since they find it stressful and it is better for them I have decreased the times I take him out.

I've had two veileds. One was a sweetheart the other was evil. I now have a panther and he wants to come out of his viv every day. He has been handled since he was a baby. I looked after two babies for a pet shop as they were too small to sell and they came onto my hand when I wanted to clean them out and to weigh them. Some are sociable some are not.

ah ok, so i guess it comes down to luck of the draw as to whether your chameleons like being handled or not, so i guess advice would be to handle it a lot as a baby and if he likes it continue and if not dont do it as much?

And i guess that the 18month cham in the shop that was happy to climb all over me and sit on my neck for a while is a freindly fellow and will like to come out and play which is what i would prefer =) although it could just be he didnt like the not so good cage he was in haha

How long did both of your veil's live for?

I had them before I found this forum and went on the pet shop advice. I now know that they were over supplemented with d3. They lived for around 2 years. I have learned and changed so much since I became educated Popeye is now two and a half and appears healthy and thriving.

A picture of the cham in the shop would be great. if he is 18 months old, you should be able to easily tell what condition he is in and how he has been kept. As for babies, 3-4 months old is a good time to get them. Any younger is risky. Yemen or Veiled chameleons are pretty hardy, as far as chams go, and you would prob be fine with a baby, even tho your a first timer. You seem to know some stuff and have put some time in researching. I recently got a veiled cham and he is very very shy. His father is like a dog, very friendly and will give kisses. My cham is shy and can be aggressive, but nothing wrong with a little attitude. I think the mean ones are endearing. Also dont be discouraged if your cham is aggressive at first or wonderful at first and turns mean. In my experience, I have noticed that chams change their behavior as they grow and it is always changing. I had a panther that was the friendliest baby, but the worst adolescent ie 6-8 month old. always biting me. now he is super chill and doesnt care about handling at all. It all changes, love the cham for who he/she is and enjoy the hobby.

Kate said:

I had them before I found this forum and went on the pet shop advice. I now know that they were over supplemented with d3. They lived for around 2 years. I have learned and changed so much since I became educated Popeye is now two and a half and appears healthy and thriving.

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Two years is really short, makes me worry as the cham i am looking at is 18 months! but hopefully if hes healthy he will get to at least 5 hopefully much more.

Ill stop by the shop tomorrow and get some pictures and ask them about how he is feeding, shedding, drinking and pooing and ask you guys if its all good lol and maybe ask to hold him one more time and see if he is as lively as he was so awesome today haha