Somthing wrong with Rango

Hi guys. I think there might be something wrong with my Panther Chameleon, Rango.

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Panther Chameleon, male, 4.5months old. I have him now for almost 3 weeks
Handling - About 3 times a week. (trying to tame him)
Feeding - I'm currently feeding a mix of Dubia Roaches, Lobster Roaches and Silkworms. He normally eats around 9 smallish roaches and 4 - 6 silkworms per day. My feeders are eating a gutload that I got from the breeder ( a mix of dog pellets, oats, cornflakes, protein powder, crested gecko diet, corn, calcium, reptivite - as far as I know).
Supplements - I dust every feeding with calcium (only the roaches) and I give him Reptivite + D3 every second week.
Watering - I handmist his cage around 5 times a day. He wont drink infront of me but I know he is drinking judging by his poo.
Fecal Description - His fecals look normal except sometimes its a bit watery and gooey. The white is white not yellow. He has not been tested for parasites.
History - unknown

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Zoomed Full Screen cage. 40x40x60cm
Lighting - Zoomed Repti Glo 5.0 Florescent tube. And a repti zoo 50w basking light. He is on a 12 hour schedule.
Temperature - His basking spot is around 33'c and the bottom 3rd of the cage is 22'c. Both measured with analogue meters.
Humidity - around 40-60%. Measured with analogue meter
Plants - Ficus benjamena, schefflera
Placement - Cage is in my room. The top of the cage is around 1.5m from the floor.
Location - South-Africa, Cape Town

Current Problem - He randomly just opens his mouth for around 20 seconds multiple times a day. At first I thought it might have been heat related but my temps are correct and he even does it when I have no basking light on at all. He sits completely still doing it so its not like he is aggressive or afraid of something. He is really active and his grip is firm. He eats like a pig and poops once a day.

I dont see anything weird in his mouth and he doesnt make any hissing or popping noises.

I have asked the breeder if he might know what the problem is. He recons I'm overfeeding and supplementing him. Are 9 roaches and 4 silkworms too much for a 4.5month old panther? The breeder told me to feed him crickets (not roaches) every 3rd day. and to only dust calcium once a week and reptive once every 2 weeks.

I have noticed that he is very agro towards me lately. He will try to bite me when my hand comes close to him ( he didnt do this before).







Please any advice would be helpful.

When did he last shed? Shedding can make them a bit grumpy, and they will open their mouths...almost like yawning...to stretch and crack the skin.

Khutchens said:

When did he last shed? Shedding can make them a bit grumpy, and they will open their mouths...almost like yawning...to stretch and crack the skin.

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He shed within the first week that I got him. So thats about 2 weeks ago

Does he only do it when your near him. If so, it's most likely just a behavioral response to try to warn you he's a tough guy and to back off! If he does it when he doesn't see you then it could be a simple as a pre shed to as severe as an early respiratory infection.

Sohumvet said:

Does he only do it when your near him. If so, it's most likely just a behavioral response to try to warn you he's a tough guy and to back off! If he does it when he doesn't see you then it could be a simple as a pre shed to as severe as an early respiratory infection.

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He does it if I'm around or not. I caught him doing it once when I entered the room so its not me.

Are there any other signs of RI that I should look for? Should I take him to a vet?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Panther Chameleon, male, 4.5months old. I have him now for almost 3 weeks
Handling - About 3 times a week. (trying to tame him)One thing you should know, you can never really tame a chameleon, they run the house If he is showing signs of stress, as he is now, give him some space. He'll either come around, or he won't, either way you'll be able to handle him at least sometimes
Feeding - I'm currently feeding a mix of Dubia Roaches, Lobster Roaches and Silkworms. He normally eats around 9 smallish roaches and 4 - 6 silkworms per day. My feeders are eating a gutload that I got from the breeder ( a mix of dog pellets, oats, cornflakes, protein powder, crested gecko diet, corn, calcium, reptivite - as far as I know) I wouldn't give them dog food..it has been known to be too high in protien and cause gout. I would just do fresh fruits and veggies with some oats or unsalted sunflower seeds/crackers.
Supplements - I dust every feeding with calcium (only the roaches) and I give him Reptivite + D3 every second week.
Watering - I handmist his cage around 5 times a day. He wont drink infront of me but I know he is drinking judging by his poo.
Fecal Description - His fecals look normal except sometimes its a bit watery and gooey. The white is white not yellow. He has not been tested for parasites.
History - unknown

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Zoomed Full Screen cage. 40x40x60cm
Lighting - Zoomed Repti Glo 5.0 Florescent tube. And a repti zoo 50w basking light. He is on a 12 hour schedule.
Temperature - His basking spot is around 33'c and the bottom 3rd of the cage is 22'c. Both measured with analogue meters.
Humidity - around 40-60%. Measured with analogue meter
Plants - Ficus benjamena, schefflera
Placement - Cage is in my room. The top of the cage is around 1.5m from the floor.
Location - South-Africa, Cape Town

Current Problem - He randomly just opens his mouth for around 20 seconds multiple times a day. At first I thought it might have been heat related but my temps are correct and he even does it when I have no basking light on at all. He sits completely still doing it so its not like he is aggressive or afraid of something. He is really active and his grip is firm. He eats like a pig and poops once a day.

I dont see anything weird in his mouth and he doesnt make any hissing or popping noises.

I have asked the breeder if he might know what the problem is. He recons I'm overfeeding and supplementing him. Are 9 roaches and 4 silkworms too much for a 4.5month old panther? The breeder told me to feed him crickets (not roaches) every 3rd day. and to only dust calcium once a week and reptive once every 2 weeks.

I would change the gutload honestly. Maybe that will make a difference? JMO, some other members might have different advice but those are just my thoughts

I have noticed that he is very agro towards me lately. He will try to bite me when my hand comes close to him ( he didnt do this before).

Some symptoms of RI are: increased mucus in the chameleon’s mouth;
popping or crackling sounds when breathing; labored breathing; gasping and opening its mouth even in the low temperature range; lungs often overly inflated; and swelling in the the forehead (between eyes) and even eyes (looked puffy).

I have no experience with a RI, but this is what I've found in some of my research. Hope that helps!

Usually with a respiratory infection you will hear moist sounds when they breath or coughing. As well they tend to build up mucus in the back of their mouths. I still think in your case he's putting on a defensive posture. They have excellent eye sight and he could have seen you enter the room. And a lot of panthers are grumpy at his age anyway. Having said that I think you should monitor him closely and if he starts having any coughing or moist sounds take him to a good reptile vet. Also you might be able to get a good look in his mouth when he gapes. Use a small flashlight to look for the phlegm/mucus. If you see it then get him to your vet and have them do a culture and sensitivity on the mucus.
I've cultured out some pretty nasty bacteria in chameleons with respiratory infections. Things like E. coli and Enterobacter which are fecal contaminates.

Sohumvet said:

Usually with a respiratory infection you will hear moist sounds when they breath or coughing. As well they tend to build up mucus in the back of their mouths. I still think in your case he's putting on a defensive posture. They have excellent eye sight and he could have seen you enter the room. And a lot of panthers are grumpy at his age anyway. Having said that I think you should monitor him closely and if he starts having any coughing or moist sounds take him to a good reptile vet. Also you might be able to get a good look in his mouth when he gapes. Use a small flashlight to look for the phlegm/mucus. If you see it then get him to your vet and have them do a culture and sensitivity on the mucus.
I've cultured out some pretty nasty bacteria in chameleons with respiratory infections. Things like E. coli and Enterobacter which are fecal contaminates.

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Thanks! I'll keep a close eye on him. So do I continue feeding him like I do? 9 roaches and 4 silkworms every day? Or should I cut down on his feeding? I will gutload with some fruit and veggies from now on.

I looked down his mouth today and didnt notice anything weird... I also dont hear any sounds coming from his mouth but I will definitely keep a close eye on him.

Update on Rango

Hi guys...

I felt that I would rather take Rango to the vet before things get serious.

The vet fully examined him and also tested one of his fecals for parasites. He says Rango is very healthy and there is nothing wrong with him. he has no sign of RI (mucus, bubbles or what ever) or parasites. His sinuses are also clean. No problems with breathing etc.

The vet recons it might just be a behavioural thing...

What do you guys think?

That was my original thought also. I think your in the clear.

Most excellent! Glad to hear you took Rango to the vet - my motto is 'better safe than sorry'...and trust me, I've had experience with an RI before and while treatable, it can be very stressful for both cham and owner! Good job on the husbandry - it seems everything is pretty bang on, except for the gutloading! I would not recommend you giving your feeders the dog food as it is high in protein and does cause gout eventually. The best thing you can do is provide fresh fruit and veggies to your feeders as this will keep them hydrated and well fed with all the nutrients your cham needs. ferretinmyshoes has a wonderful blog that details the basics of gutloading. You can read it here:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/ferretinmyshoes/446-basics-gutloading.html

I don't think you are feeding too much. The general rule is feed as much as he'll eat within a 5 minute period. This works well if you are cup feeding as you can keep track of whats been eaten. Once 5 minutes is up, take the cup out. I am also not sure what time of the day you are feeding your cham but if you feed early, soon after lights ON, then your cham has time to digest the food while under the UVB bulb during the day. I feed on this schedule and will give my chams a hornworm or silkie in the afternoon as a 'treat'. Also, because you are feeding your cham silk's this is what's making his poo runny and watery. It does not indicate a problem however, its just how the dynamic of the worms are once digested.

I would suggest improving your supplementation. Another general rule is: Dust with Calcium without D3 at every feeding, dust with Calcium w/D3 twice a month and dust with a multivitamin twice a month. Member, MollyT suggests dusting with Cal w/D3 on one Sunday, then dust with a multivitamin on the next Sunday, then alternating again. This is an excellent supplementation schedule. You can always 'tweak' the supplements once your guy has grown a bit more and you know what his specific needs are. For example I recently introduced preformed Vitamin A into my supplementation schedule as I'm trying to improve eye and gout problems in my 4 year old veiled. I do not recommend you do this yet as an overdose of Vitamin A is possible. However I am just making you aware that once you know what specific needs your cham requires, you can adjust your supplements over time.

These are the products I use when supplementing:
The top jar is my every day calcium, the bottom two are the supp's I give twice a month on a rotating schedule.


I also think you've got a feisty little guy on your hands! If he's relatively new to you, give him some time to acclimate and then provide gentle handling when you think he's ready. He'll come around if he's smart and learns who's in charge of the food! Good luck - he's a handsome little guy!