New Owner

I just rescued a veiled that has now seen 3 owners and I dont think she is over a year yet She is my first chameleon since my friend couldnt keep her and I worry that while at her previous owners that she did not have suitable lighting/temps. What are the signs of MBD? And she looks a little skinny (faintly can see outline of hip) should i try and make her more plump? Any info you can give me would be great. Oh and she sways back and forth sometimes when i am near her cage is that normal?

mlmedlen said:

I just rescued a veiled that has now seen 3 owners and I dont think she is over a year yet She is my first chameleon since my friend couldnt keep her and I worry that while at her previous owners that she did not have suitable lighting/temps. What are the signs of MBD? And she looks a little skinny (faintly can see outline of hip) should i try and make her more plump? Any info you can give me would be great. Oh and she sways back and forth sometimes when i am near her cage is that normal?

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Ok, signs of MBD are curved joints and poor grip.
Feed her as much as she wants right now. After she gets some wait you may want to searh this topic here on the forum. we can talk about that issue later. I want you to read my caresheet. ask any question if you have them.


Veiled and Panther Care sheet

HOUSING- Adult- With Veiled and Panther chameleons their seems to be a standard of 24(w) x24(d) x48(h). One chameleon per cage! These numbers can be tweaked slightly, such as width and depth. A chameleon cage can never be too high. I would try not to make your cage any less than 18x18, and this is if you don’t have any room. The cage should always be made up of screen. At least four sides (top, left, right, back and front) the top must always be screen because your light will be coming in from there. As far as the other four sides any choice off three is sufficient. I have found the best screen material to use is aluminum. It doesn’t rust or melt. It is also easier to see through and UV light enters the cage easier.
Juvenile- An average size juvenile cage is around an 18x18x36. This size cage is good until about the age of one year. If it is a large male you can upgrade sooner.
BABIES- newly born chameleons can be kept in a glass cage together for 7-8 weeks tops. After the age of two months they should be placed in a fully screened cage, and they can still be kept together. Once they are separated around the age of 2.5-3 months and sold they should be kept in a screen enclosure measuring 12x12x24-30. This should be suffice until the age of 6 months. Now it’s time to upgrade to a juvenile cage.
Safe Plants- Hibiscus-my favorite choice, Jasmine, Ficus Benjamina, Croton, Scheffelera Arobricola (Umbrella Plant), Photos, and Airplants. I have used all of these personally and I have found them easy to find and care for.
WATERING- most chameleons will not drink from standing water. There are rare cases that this occurs, but is not a substitute for proper watering. Proper watering should be done through a dripper all day and misting. I have found that the “Big Dripper” will go all day long if you have it dripping at one drop per second. Hand or automated misting should be done 2-3 times daily. You can use a spray bottle or buy a Pro Mist set-up for about 200$ and it does it by itself. Chameleons drink by shooting his/her tongue out at water droplets on leaves. Live plants are far superior to fake plants. They hold water droplets at the end of each leaf. Silk plants usually have the water drip off as soon as it makes contact. I have found that fake moss is a great way to supply water. If it is placed right under your dripper the water will run down to the tips of each piece. This is between 30-70 ends. Waterfalls and bowls help to harbor the growth of bacteria some of these bacteria can cause an Upper Respiratory Infection (URI), so they should be avoided at all cost.
HUMIDITY- The ambient humidity in the cage should be in the 40-50% range. With a spike of 70-80% during and after misting. This isn’t as true for Veiled Chameleons; they can be kept at a lower humidity. If you aren’t lucky enough to live in Florida a cheap humidifier from Walgreens will be fine. Try to stay away from foggers, as these can be frightening to your chameleon. Not to mention more expensive than a humidifier. Higher humidity also helps aid in the shedding process for your chameleon. Generally you will see an “explosive” shed when humidity is high. Meaning all the skin will come off at once. In lower humidity it may take days for it to come off.
LIGHTING- This is a huge area of concern to a chameleon’s health. UVB light helps with absorption of calcium to create strong bones. UVB also aids in the absorption and production of D3. Without proper UVB light a chameleon can develop MBD (Metabolic Bone Disease). The most fool proof light on the market is the Reptisun 5.0. studies have found it superior to the Reptiglo 5.0 for chameleons. Do not purchase the compact bulb. These have been known to cause eye problems, such as photo-kerato-conjunctivitis. Lights should be kept on for 10-12 hours a day. Chameleons can only absorb the UV from these lights close up. The maximum effective range is about ten inches. I have personally used the latest lighting on the market with great success, the Mercury Vapor Bulbs. They are an all in one, both heat and UVB output. The maximum effective range of these bulbs is over 12 inches. As far as temperature goes, Veiled’s are a little warmer about 95 basking temperature or what I call the “hot spot”. The “hot spot” temperature can be acquired using standard house light bulbs ranging from 45-75 watts. A household bulb admits UVA light that stimulates appetite. This should be the temperature in one area on the top of the cage and the rest should be in the 80’s. The rest of the cage should vary, and into the mid 70’s at the bottom. Panther’s should have a basking temperature around 90 degrees. Same goes for the cage having varying temperatures. Babies should always be cooler around 85 degrees max basking for both species. Remember nothing can compare to natural sunlight. The best time to put your chameleon outside is between 10 and 2 o’clock.
SUPPLEMENTING- This is a key factor in the survival of your chameleon. In captivity we do not supply the chameleon with enough feeders to meet the vitamin/mineral demands of a chameleon. So this is taken care of through dusting and gutloading. Most of the feeders we buy today are high and Phosphorous and low in calcium. There is only one way to take care of this problem. I like to use Herpcares cricket duster because it saves supplement and you don’t need to touch the feeder. Not every cricket needs to be dusted either, nor do they need to look like ghost from being covered in so much calcium. Gutloading is a term used when feeder insects are given food to eat that is rich in nutrients. There are several cricket foods on the market today that can be used. Try to stay away from potatoes because they are very high in phosphorous. There are 3 main supplements used today. My schedule looks like: Mondays and Thursdays- Calcium, Tuesdays and Fridays-Rep Cal Herptivite, Wednesdays and Saturdays- T-Rex Chameleon Formula or Mineral-All(indoor). A lot of people have their own schedule and tricks. I also rotate every week between Calcium with D3 and without D3. A chameleon can overdose and die from too much D3.
FEEDERS- Chameleons need a wide range of feeders to stay healthy. We as owners will never be able to supply them with what they would get in the wild. That is why having several staple feeders with proper supplements and gutloading is critical to the survival of captive chameleons. Some of my favorite feeders are; Crickets, roaches, super worms, Silkworms, hornworms, phoenix worms, butter worms, wax worms, and mealworms. Crickets will most likely be you main feeder, that being said they are very poor in nutritional value. They need to be gut loaded with a good cricket food and 2/3 of them should be dusted per feeding. Silkworms and hornworms are fantastic feeders; these can be placed in the cage and don’t need dusting. They are also ferocious eaters, so keep plenty of food available. Phoenix worms are great for juvenile and baby chameleons; they are high in calcium and do not need to be supplemented. They only grow to about ¾” so aren’t much good for adults.

mlmedlen said:

I just rescued a veiled that has now seen 3 owners and I dont think she is over a year yet She is my first chameleon since my friend couldnt keep her and I worry that while at her previous owners that she did not have suitable lighting/temps. What are the signs of MBD? And she looks a little skinny (faintly can see outline of hip) should i try and make her more plump? Any info you can give me would be great. Oh and she sways back and forth sometimes when i am near her cage is that normal?

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swaying back and forth is normal. It is his way staying hidden from you by imitating leaf movement blown by the wind.
MBD symptoms:
curvy legs or extra joints.
bent casque.
chameleon is not able to lift up his body with his legs.
Lethargic
weak grip
always hangs out at the bottom of the enclosure.

Thanks so much. She looks young but i am not sure. She is around 4 or 5 inches long and has a good green color. Her cage is all mesh 20(h)x18(w)x12(d) has a 5.0 (compact) uvb lamb and a 75 watt basking light to maintain temps. Should I get another uvb lamp since it is compact? I have seen none of those signs for MBD so hopefully she is ok. She hasnt eaten yet but she has been here for only 2 days. I am not sure if she is drinking she gets misted often to keep humidity around at least 40 and has a makeshift dripper.

Yes-please get rid of the compact. You can get a Zoomed Reptisun bulb from LLL for 13.99. 4 or 5 inches total length or snout to vent? I would mist her for 5-10 minutes to see if you can get her to drink. What size crickets are you feeding?

No compact bulbs. And if you replace it with a repti sun 5.0 I would suggest lowering your basking wattage. (Or at least playing with it. 75 Watts with the light, makes Zey's cage WAY too hot for her.)


You can't control what happened to the chameleon in her old homes, all you can do is make sure that she has the best care

She is about 4 or so inches from nose to base of tail. She leaves her tail curled mostly and i am trying to stay out of her cage as much as i can. She ate 2 crickets (lrg) as soon as i fed her today. Instead of getting one long uvb lamp could i get another compact, my lid holds 2 compacts so if i dont need a new one i would rather not get one for this cage. If its a necessity though i will. I did manage to catch her grab some water so maybe she is doing better than i thought. Since i dont know her age does any one know what size they are when they can lay infertile eggs or the signs for it? Just so I can store that in my memory for when that happens. Wow she just ate 2 more

mlmedlen said:

She is about 4 or so inches from nose to base of tail. She leaves her tail curled mostly and i am trying to stay out of her cage as much as i can. She ate 2 crickets (lrg) as soon as i fed her today. Instead of getting one long uvb lamp could i get another compact, my lid holds 2 compacts so if i dont need a new one i would rather not get one for this cage. If its a necessity though i will. I did manage to catch her grab some water so maybe she is doing better than i thought. Since i dont know her age does any one know what size they are when they can lay infertile eggs or the signs for it? Just so I can store that in my memory for when that happens. Wow she just ate 2 more

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DO not use the compacts. They have been causing problems such as blindness and death. Get a Reptisun 5.0 flourescent tube. If you don't know her age I would put a flower pot 10-12 inches deep and maybe 10 inches in diameter filled with play sand or organic soil just in case.

mlmedlen,

Welcome to the site, and welcome to the hobby.

Please read and educate yourself with this site, http://uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor.htm#intro about the problems with certain compact and linear fluorescent bulbs that have recently been released into the market.

Members will likely suggest Zoo Med’s ReptiSun 5.0. linear fluorescent bulb fixed atop the cage to supply proper UVB. This is a long term tested and proven bulb with good success.

mlmedlen...welcome to the forum!

Can you post a picture of her?

What temperature do you have the basking area at? Appropriate temperature helps with proper digestion.

What supplements do you use and how often? Do you gutload the insects and feed them a nutritious diet? Calcium, D3, phosphorous, vitamin A are the main players in bone health and need to be in balance. You need to look at what you feed the insects, what you feed to the chameleon and what supplements you use to dust the insects with when trying to attain a balance.

Has she got a place to dig should she need to? They can start producing eggs at 5 months...sometimes younger.

Here are some sites you might like to read...
http://www.adcham.com/
http://www.chameleonnews.com/
http://web.archive.org/web/20060502...als.com/vet/index.php?show=8.Gout.Basics.html

Hope she does well with you!

Kinyonga has left out a link to the site where she just wrote an article on the specific keeping of female veileds.
Check it out:

http://raisingkittytheveiledchameleon.blogspot.com/2007/12/keeping-female-veiled.html

-Brad

Oops! What can I say??

My girl seems to be doing good now. I got her some new live plants and got her to eat a wax work along with some crickets. Is it normal that she only ate 2 one day 5 the next and 2 and a wax worm today? She has been drinking much better and is more active(every time i walk near the cage she stares me down or climbs away). Oh about what size does she need to be when I move her to a larger cage?

mlmedlen said:

My girl seems to be doing good now. I got her some new live plants and got her to eat a wax work along with some crickets. Is it normal that she only ate 2 one day 5 the next and 2 and a wax worm today? She has been drinking much better and is more active(every time i walk near the cage she stares me down or climbs away). Oh about what size does she need to be when I move her to a larger cage?

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i would not let her get use to waxworm.
Waxworm is equivalent to a cheese burger and fries in the insect world.
There are many better feeder for her health sake.

a baby chameleon tends to eat more than that. (usually about 12-18 small crickets).
Perhaps, she eat less because she is still adjusting to her new environment.
If this occurs daily, i would keep a good eye on her for a while.

I tried to give her the wax worms just to see if she was bored with crickets. I hope its just the adjustment of moving. She hasnt yet produced a fecal either which i assume is because she hasnt consumed enough. Should i look into force feeding her? I am going out of town next weekend and want to make sure all is well before leaving her.

oh and here are some photos of her
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mlmedlen said:

I tried to give her the wax worms just to see if she was bored with crickets. I hope its just the adjustment of moving. She hasnt yet produced a fecal either which i assume is because she hasnt consumed enough. Should i look into force feeding her? I am going out of town next weekend and want to make sure all is well before leaving her.

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how long has it been since her last fecal?
You should get somebody to babysit your baby chameleon.

I am not sure when her last fecal was she has been living with me since sunday and i havent seen any evidence of it. I have my parents babysitting her while i am gone they are being trained daily on how to do it all.

If you look at the pics look at her hip which kind of protrudes. Thats what really worries me it that she is too skinny especcially since she doenst eat much

mlmedlen said:

If you look at the pics look at her hip which kind of protrudes. Thats what really worries me it that she is too skinny especcially since she doenst eat much

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you are right.. that's a bad sign.
generally, you should not be able to see chameleon's pelvic bone that clear.
plus 5 days straight with no pooping.. worries me.
She might have an impaction (could be the reason why she won't eat either).
I think you should bring her to a vet asap.

The only vet i trust with reptiles wont be back until wednesday so until then does anyone have any suggestions on what to do if she is impacted or if she is just malnurished? And what would she be acting like if she was impacted? Anything you can think of would be helpful she is getting more active everyday so i thought that she was doing better