coccidia treatment

hi all, the new girl is eating like a pig but she does have some parasites the dreaded coccidia has anyone ever used tms oral suspension at 30mg per kg to treat this my vet says albon and panacure and metronidazole don't work as well. any info or feedback would be appreciated thanks
jeff

triumphfreak said:

...she does have some parasites the dreaded coccidia has anyone ever used tms oral suspension at 30mg per kg to treat this my vet says albon and panacure and metronidazole don't work as well...

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Howdy Jeff,

Quickie note now:

From several vet sources, Albon (Sulfadimethoxine) is considered to be the #1 choice for Coccidia.

The 2nd choice is Trimethoprim sulfa.

I'm guessing that TMS might stand for Trimethoprim sulfa ??? If it isn't, I'm interested to know what is being prescribed .

Some chameleons have a tough time with Albon vs. Trimethoprim sulfa. Albon seems to upset their systems, slowing down interest in food and becoming lethargic, especially over extended treatments. Trimethoprim sulfa seems to have very few side effects even during extended treatments lasting many weeks.

Unfortunately, neither drug can be expected to have a 100% cure rate. Younger chameleons with strong immune systems seem to do a better job of clearing coccidia after the drug has brought the numbers down to manageable levels. Older chameleons whose immune systems are not in tip-top condition may never be able to clear coccidia from their systems. If treatment is stopped, the numbers usually balloon back up to heavy counts. Coccidia, in small numbers, isn't nearly as dangerous as it can be in high counts. As it multiplies, it destroys the intestinal lining host cell that it pops out of. If the chameleon's replacement system can keep-up with the losses, things might stay ok. If it can't or if a bacterial infection takes hold then life-threatening troubles can compound. So a chameleon with coccidia might die of an intestional, secondary infection rather than being overwhelmed by the parasites themselves like in the case of roundworms plugging-up internal organs.

Panacur and metronidazole do nothing for coccidia.

Coccidia is one tough little organism . Good feeders that are gutloaded with high quality foods are thought to be a good way to boost immune systems making the job of drugs dealing with parasites like coccidia potentially more effective.

I can add as testimony about Albon like what Dave said.
Some chameleon might be have an adverse side effect over Albon treatment (either by the medication and/or by the stress induced from continuous therapy).

Mine seems to emaciate himself after Albon therapy.
(this continues for 2 weeks of no solid food -i use Repta Aid once. Soon after a conversation with my vet, we agree to stop the Albon therapy until he regain his usual body weight).

but, I also have friends who have succeeded battling coccidia with Albon.

Both the female veiled chams we got from Pertsmarts had coccidia. One was treated with albon, and is now clean. Throughout the process she never lost her appetite. The other was also treated with albon, and dropped from 120g to 75g during treatment. Even with us forcefeeding her. We would discontinue treatment periodically. When we stopped treatment she began eating like a pig again on her own. We were very watchful of their food intake, and monitored their weights, keeping charts. The force feeding was necessary, not only to try to maintain weight, but more importantly to keep the immune system healthy.

We have a male panther cham for whom albon did not do the trick against the coccidia. He is now being treated with Trimethoprim sulfa. His appetite has improved with the TMS as opposed to albon. His coccidia counts have dropped, but we are watching for further results.

Two important notes: When treating an animal with one of these drugs be especially watchful for dehydration. The books say to mist chams more often, and for longer periods, if they are taking one of these drugs, and we have found it to be necessary. Signs of dehydration quickly showed in their urates, even with a little extra watering. Additional watering, and showers, were necessary to maintain hydration. Secondly, be very watchful of appetite and food intake.

o yes. Thanks for the added info, Gesang.
I remember showering him more often and adding a pedialyte in his dripper during the treatment.

thanks for all the feedback!!! tms a pediatric human product in liquid form.
TMS- trimethoprim sulfa (Sulfatrim Pediatric Suspension, Alpharma USPD Inc,
Baltimore, MD 21244)

thats what i thought about albon, that is was the 1# recomended treatment for coccidia
I guess with all the loss of appetite stuff i'll give the tms a try I'm supposed to treat sid for 7 days then recheck stool on 7 th day then recheck stool in 1 month from that date
thanks jeff

Hi,

Well I was battling Coccidia it seems like forever, I bought a (supposedly captive born) chameleon last year from Chameleons by Design, who sold her to me with a load of parasites and my fav coccidia my vet said with that load of parasites she was most likely wild caught. I recently won the battle after 7 months. What I did, I had one of those mesh cages that break apart (Reptarium) and I bought some thick wire clothes line from home depot so she would have something to walk on easy to clean and remove from cage. I took the cage apart everyday and washed it in hot water and ammonia. At first the vet tried albon, we tried that for a long while,and it didnt work. So the vet looked into some alternatives and found Sulfamethoxazole w/tmp susphit. Now she doesnt have coccidia anymore. All the medicines did run her poor little immune system down though.

The other thing you can do is give NutirBAC df Probiotic for reptiles to help them deal with any antibiotics your vet gives them, helps promote "good" bacteria" in the tummy.

http://search.store.yahoo.com/cgi-bi...tileinc.com/

http://www.cornutopia.com/Corn Uto...nformation.htm

Hope this helps all ...

Sorry to hear about your trials with coccidia. It can seem to go on forever. Good job wiping it out.

Yes, we heartily recommend a probiotic following any medication with antibiotic properties, such as the TMS.

We did purchase one chameleon, from a reputable dealer, that carried coccidia. We know the cham was captive bred. So, it can happen. Even from very reputable breeders. We've purchased 5 chameleons from Chameleons by Design, that were all parasite free (we did fecals on them) and doing great to this day. So, it's not always predictable, and doesn't necessarily reflect on the breeder.

Not all chams with coccidia (or other parasites) look sick. That's why many on this forum recommend owner's get annual exams and fecal checks on their chams.

hi this little girl is from kammerflage creations and definatly captive born there is a really great reptile shop here in chicago that gets their cams from them, so Glittergloomgirl how long did you have to treat with tms to be rid of coccidia??
thanks jeff

My female actually had coccidia, hookworms, trichomonas, and clostridium. If she was cb is it possible to have those types of parasites? and in such a large load that it took 7 months to get rid of it, I might as well have bought wc to get a new bloodline, since the parasites were there anyway. I think its kinda pointless to buy a captive bred then over a wild caught if they are both gonna have a bunch of parasites. I just was under the impression that when you bought from a reputable breeder you would be getting a healthy animal. I was just very disappointed that it wasnt the case with this chameleon. The situation I guess has left a bad taste in my mouth because it was a very long not to mention pricey process, to get rid of the coccida. I still have to go to have a stool sample checked to see if the clostridium and trichmonas are finally gone, so Im now actually going on 8 months with this problem.

I would agree I think the same way, you pay a premium price from an "expert" and you'd expect the animal to be free of parasites and their not!! better animal husbandry would solve allot of these problems I'm sure , maybe Dave or someone else knows, can chameleons be born with parasites like dogs and cats can??
thanks Jeff

Jeff I used the TMS for 7 days sid same as you, then I was to recheck the stool 2 weeks later, then once a week for 3 weeks.

Gesang thank you for your comment about beating the coccida She is doing much better now and happy that Im not messing with her lol!

at 30 mg per kg??
thanks jeff

im not sure of that...I gave 3 lines on a 30 unit insulin syringe.....

thanks for the info
jeff

No prob Jeff anytime

Even the best of breeders can get parasite loaded crickets from time to time. Nobody should blame a breeder for a pre existing problem, unless the animal in question was obviously in decline when shipped. You can only do so much to prevent these outbreaks, so keep that in mind before any blame is made. One housefly can do the trick also, so do you know what your cham snaps up while you let him cruise around in he open?

PEMEX said:

Even the best of breeders can get parasite loaded crickets from time to time. Nobody should blame a breeder for a pre existing problem, unless the animal in question was obviously in decline when shipped. You can only do so much to prevent these outbreaks, so keep that in mind before any blame is made. One housefly can do the trick also, so do you know what your cham snaps up while you let him cruise around in he open?

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I still dont believe breeders should sell animals with parasites, If they do though and the issue is found during the guarantee period, I believe the breeder should make arrangements with the buyer to treat the problem. Ways to solve this problem are to return the animal and have a replacement sent. Maybe return the animal have the breeder treat it till it is healthy to send out again. Anyway I dont believe the person buying a CB or CH chameleon should be responsible to treat this problem thats why there are guarantees. In my situation the breeder never returned my calls when I told them my chameleon had all these parasites, and this was during my guarantee period. I just honestly think its unfair to buyers.

So are you trying to say I am to blame for the parasites in my cham by saying I let it roam around in the first day I had it and on the second day when I looked at the poop worms were wiggling in it? I thought pre existing conditions were more like nip tails, missing toes, curve in back... things that you were told about when you were purchasing the animal.

yes i'm a vet tech and i got my cham on sunday at 3:30 pm and sent out a stool sample on monday morning first thing so in 24 hours my cham got coccidia from an empty cage wthat never had a cham in it
jeff

Hey Jeff,

Did you let the pet store you bought it from know that your Chameleon had coccidia? and If so what was there response...